Okay, I really didn't get it. EdMuse said that it could pass through the wall of the safe. Okay, so I see that it did that.... what's the point? I mean, obviously it's bizarre and unnatural. But what's the point? Humans traveling through walls?

As I think of it, one of two things...



On the Massive Dynamic website, they mention that their technology "has been installed in government agencies and corporate offices worldwide." Big Brother, anyone? There are other examples that could be read as Massive Dynamic trying to get their tendrils in all over the place. The idea of being able to walk through walls could come in very handy if that's the plan.
Or maybe the writers were just trying to come up with a really weird machine. For some reason, I was expecting the apple to somehow pass through the wall of the safe. It was just what it seemed like what should happen: you put an apple in a safe -- you put anything in a safe -- on television, you almost know it's going to end up out of the safe. If not why would they use a safe? I mean, either it was going to pass through the wall of the safe, or it was going to turn into a kitten or something. So perhaps the writers were just playing on the need to have this equation do something strange.

So either they've got some big idea in mind, or they don't. :tracy:

But I also mentioned in the "watching live" thread -- and I'd like to have some corroboration on this -- that the apple in the safe seemed like something kind of along the same lines as a "Rambaldi Device" from Alias. As I was sitting there waiting for the apple to pass through the wall of the safe, I was thinking about how it would seem like that when it did. Probably just a stylistic thing, though: same production company, same stylistic elements.

I guess I didn't even notice that it was a safe. I was thinking it was like a microwave, honestly. But your intuition was sure on the mark!

I'll have to watch that part again. It was like Mitchell could pass his hand through, what was supposed to be a safe door, with a glove on his hand and bring the apple through it.

I don't know what the set up was, maybe it will make more sense then.

I'll have to watch that part again. It was like Mitchell could pass his hand through, what was supposed to be a safe door, with a glove on his hand and bring the apple through it.

I don't know what the set up was, maybe it will make more sense then.

Mitchell was the guy from last week that put the parasite in his body. We know he was associated with the Scientist(Mr.Jones) that was being held in a Maximun Security Prison in Germany.

How do you possibly spring the scientist(Mr Jones) from a Maximum Security Prison??

Find out how to get an apple from a safe by going through it. They are going to break Mr Jones out of the jail and needed to figure it out.

I think "Little Hill" was some type of password last week that they needed to complete the sequence they have been trying to get for 10 years. When they hooked up the kid to that computer they finally broke through. I think the "Little Hill" was the component needed to complete the task.

I thought it meant they were planning on stealing something important. I actually thought that was obvious, clearly it isn't. Connrick if they were working with Dr. Jones they could have just asked him for the code word or whatever little hill is, well that's my opinion at least.

I thought it meant they were planning on stealing something important. I actually thought that was obvious, clearly it isn't. Connrick if they were working with Dr. Jones they could have just asked him for the code word or whatever little hill is, well that's my opinion at least.

Dr Jones didn't know the codeword. The plan was for Mitchell to inject himself with the parasite knowing that Walter would try to save him. Jones knew that they would come to him to ask for the cure.

Jones and Mitchell knew that Walter can somehow get information from a dead person and figured the guy(I can't get his name) that had the answer would be killed that was the only way they were going to get "little Hill".

If that guy remained alive, he wasn't giving up the answer. I hope that makes some sense.

I thought that Jones hinted that he didn't want to get out of jail. Olivia mentioned deals and getting him out didn't she?

So, if Mitchell is going to break Jones out, it's going to be against Mr. Jones' will.

Jones basically told Olivia that they we're both being used.

That was the guy from last week? omgomgomg, I didn't recognize him. (in my defence I was just trying to stay awake). That's awesome!
The husband didn't get what happened and while I wasn't sure either I told him that I had thought they were able to open a portal or reach through matter, somethin' like that.
Heh, my husband also asked if they just stretched underpants over that thing. Oy, we really go to bed too early.

Heh, my husband also asked if they just stretched underpants over that thing. Oy, we really go to bed too early.

ROTFL, I almost choked on my cereal.

Sorry!

Yeah, about the apple...I was wondering, LL, what are the ramifications of Mitchell Loeb being able to pull it through the safe? Was what happened about him being able to reach through the safe and get the apple or the apple being able to come through the safe's wall - or both?

Good memory, Sam, about Mr. Jones telling Olivia that they were both being used. He was pretty strongly hinting to Olivia that things aren't what they seem at her new job. I'm wondering if the focus of these strange events isn't really the events themselves, but how Olivia and Peter react to them and solve them. Maybe?

Does Mitchell want Jones because he's some kind of savant? Reminds me of the DI and all the mathematical savants that Mittlework had in the basement somewhere working on the VE...

My initial thought was that the apple was going to be teleported somehow. Pulling it through the wall was not what I expected, but not a surprise either. I agree, it's almost like Checkov's Gun, if you put an apple in a safe, it's coming out of the space in some super cool manner...that's just the rules.

Using music as part of the equation to do it makes sense though. Music can set up resonances in materials such as crystal. I guess one way (theoretically and highly speculative) that you could "phase" through solid matter (which, atomically speaking has a lot of open space in it) is to set up a perfect pattern of resonance between the material to be passed through and the material passing through, so that the latter moves only through the "empty spaces" in the atoms of the former.

I like the thought about using it to break Mr. Jones out for example, though I agree that he seemed to express that he was quite content to stay. Of course, he could be lying, and "quite content to stay" is not strictly speaking the same as "would not be happy to get out" It does pose the question of what it's going to be used for.

The vibrations of the stone thing in the arrival. Was it 2 and 4 MHz?

That's right. I am still waiting for the stone thing to come back. Not anytime soon, that would be too easy, but I'd love to see a callback sometime.

Okay, I didn't recognize the guy at all, and I'm not sure if I'm even connecting to the right person. Maybe I need to rewatch the last few episodes.....

Okay, I didn't recognize the guy at all, and I'm not sure if I'm even connecting to the right person. Maybe I need to rewatch the last few episodes.....

Mitchell Loeb (http://gallery.fringetelevision.com/displayimage.php?album=49&pos=23) 1.7
Mitchell Loeb (http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/SamG1/?action=view&current=Picture3-5.png) 1.8

That was the guy from last week? omgomgomg, I didn't recognize himI know! Same here! Thanx for that revelation, connrick!

Using music as part of the equation to do it makes sense though. Music can set up resonances in materials such as crystal. I guess one way (theoretically and highly speculative) that you could "phase" through solid matter (which, atomically speaking has a lot of open space in it) is to set up a perfect pattern of resonance between the material to be passed through and the material passing through, so that the latter moves only through the "empty spaces" in the atoms of the former.This is the way the Flash passes through walls, by vibrating the atoms of his body in phase with the atoms of the material he will pass through. It also has overtones (pun intended!) of the oscillation overthruster from The Adventures of Buckaroo Banzai Across the 8th Dimension (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventures_of_Buckaroo_Banzai_Across_the_8th_D imension).

But make sure to make the distinction between sound and music. It is sound that sets up resonances in crystal. Music is the creative organization of sound and silence. While passing the apple through the safe wall might have something to do with sound, or at least with vibration (which is similar to, but not always synonymous with sound), the musical aspect of the episode was that rhythmic figures in music can be represented numerically and mathematically. It was the rhythmic aspect of Ben's music, not the vibratory pitch aspect, that was important to the formula.

Speaking of vibrations, and the 2 and 4 MHz vibrations in the stone, 4 MHz is the first overtone of 2 MHz. They can be said to be an octave apart, though both are far above the range of what we would call "sound." The top end of human hearing is about 20,000 Hz, ans 2 MHz is 1000 times that frequency. But in terms of mathematics and acoustical physics, there are no two more similar pitches than a fundamental and its first overtone.

I'm kind of excited that my area of expertise might come in handy in this show. Can you tell? :rolleyes:

I thought the test was the agent's hand being able to pass through not about the apple. After all the apple was "dead" but they need to know if liviing tissue could pass through and remain intact. He was wearing a glove that looked like the same material as the "underpants". (Wasn't he?)

I didn't think about living versus nonliving matter just that they were able to move both through a solid surface, a neat little trick I would love to get my hands on. Mwah ha ha.

I thought the test was the agent's hand being able to pass through not about the apple. After all the apple was "dead" but they need to know if liviing tissue could pass through and remain intact. He was wearing a glove that looked like the same material as the "underpants". (Wasn't he?)Pretty sure the glove material was different it looked like dark grey rubber and the underwear was bright blue.

http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/SamG1/?action=view&current=Picture3-5.png
http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/SamG1/?action=view&current=Picture16.png

Can you see these?

It also seemed like Mitchell had to exert some pressure to push through the safe but pulling the apple out seemed easier.

Mitchell Loeb (http://gallery.fringetelevision.com/displayimage.php?album=49&pos=23) 1.7
Mitchell Loeb (http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/SamG1/?action=view&current=Picture3-5.png) 1.8

Oh... right. Gotcha. I think I didn't pay attention to 1.7 very well or something. Thanks!

Oh... right. Gotcha. I think I didn't pay attention to 1.7 very well or something. Thanks!Well, ya gotta admit, they showed more shots of his innards than of his face! :23wtp28_jpg:

Yeah, I also forgot, like, his name, and which man you were talking about. I was thinking it might be the guy in prison.... ? Now it's starting to make more sense. :smile:

Yeah, I also forgot, like, his name, and which man you were talking about. I was thinking it might be the guy in prison.... ? Now it's starting to make more sense. :smile:No, Marshall was the guy with the parasite in him, the guy who spent the whole episode on an operating table with the side of his chest laid open. And then, at the end, we found out he did it to himself. That guy.

Pretty sure the glove material was different it looked like dark grey rubber and the underwear was bright blue.

http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/SamG1/?action=view&current=Picture3-5.png
http://s23.photobucket.com/albums/b389/SamG1/?action=view&current=Picture16.png

Can you see these?

It also seemed like Mitchell had to exert some pressure to push through the safe but pulling the apple out seemed easier.

Could this be how Marvin Candle lost his arm????? Oh, wait a minute wrong show. :redface:

Could this be how Marvin Candle lost his arm????? Oh, wait a minute wrong show. :redface:Whoops! :23wtp28_jpg: Maybe he was looking for a snack, trying to get an apple out of a safe when someone turned the frozen donkey wheel and moved the island, but the safe, the apple and his arm all stayed behind! :eek2:

Oh, I am so confused, now. :stars:

It's like a mixed metaphor ~ there must be something we can call it.

Mitchell was the guy from last week that put the parasite in his body. We know he was associated with the Scientist(Mr.Jones) that was being held in a Maximun Security Prison in Germany.

How do you possibly spring the scientist(Mr Jones) from a Maximum Security Prison??

Find out how to get an apple from a safe by going through it. They are going to break Mr Jones out of the jail and needed to figure it out.

I think "Little Hill" was some type of password last week that they needed to complete the sequence they have been trying to get for 10 years. When they hooked up the kid to that computer they finally broke through. I think the "Little Hill" was the component needed to complete the task.


Inferior Colliculi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferior_colliculus)/Little Hill is a place in the brain. I'll be back with the info. This would go along very well with the Walter/Peter connection we've been talking about over on another thread (http://forum.thefuselage.com/showthread.php?t=104047).

Inferior Colliculi (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inferior_colliculus)/Little Hill is a place in the brain. I'll be back with the info. This would go along very well with the Walter/Peter connection we've been talking about over on another thread (http://forum.thefuselage.com/showthread.php?t=104047).Neat stuff, Sam! I responded to it in the Two Walters thread (http://forum.thefuselage.com/showthread.php?t=104047&page=3).