In light of new evidence, along with last season where Ben claimed the purge wasn't his idea and was the idea of another "leader," who do you think is responsible for the mass killing of the Dharma Initiative?

absolutely richard. he convinced ben that it was his idea. when ben was a child and wanted so badly to leave, richard saw this, convinced him to wait until the time was right and then led him to believe that it was he who wanted to get rid of the DI. that's why ben was left to take care of his father and when he returned the purge was finished. ben has felt the whole time that he, like locke now, is the leader.

neither one is.

No doubt in my mind it was Richard. It was Richard/Jacob's test to see if Ben was their new (so-called) Leader. I also think the leader here is really Richard and always has been from the beginning.

I initially thought it was almost all Ben's idea, but this season I am leaning towards Locke somehow being involved. I hate that, since I love Locke--but I just remember how much hatred Ben had when he shot Locke and pushed him into the mass grave. I know initially we thought it was a test, but it almost seems too densely symbolic to me. Then, later, when Hurley asks Ben about it and Ben says "their leader" in such disdain...it made me think of Locke running around this season proclaiming to be the leader of the Others all over the place.

I don't really want Locke to be responsible, though, so I'm thinking if he was behind it someone else manipulated him into thinking that is a sacrifice the island demanded. Maybe Richard was behind it, although Richard has also claimed that there is someone he answers to (but eventually we have to meet the man behind the curtain--right? So either he is, or he isn't).

We saw the purge happen, so it was either Ben or Richard. Can't have been Locke, he wasn't there. Even if he did time travel there to give them the idea, I doubt they'd trust a random guy who just appeared.

I think it could have been someone off screen who might have done it--sure, Richard and Ben were the ones getting their hands dirty in the trenches killing folks, but that does not mean that either person was the one who ordered it done.

It seems so far the overwhelming majority are voting for Richard, which kind of surprises me after he said in "Jughead" that he answers to someone higher than himself...then again, he is a master manipulator. Ben learned from one of the best.

Could it be Jacob through Richard to Ben?

Could it be Jacob through Richard to Ben?

It's a possibility.

I voted someone else, although now that I think about it, I was going to say that it was whoever was in charge prior to Ben, which might obviously be Widmore, too bad I already voted, although I do think Jacob gave the order.

Im guessing it was Jacob through Richard. Interesting theory that it could have been Locke though...

I think it was probably Locke that set it off but not on purpose. I don't think Locke would knowingly hurt people unless they refused to leave the island... I don't think he thinks in terms of black and white either, so to kill people including children would not be his style... but he seems to be very faithful to the point of being gullible when it comes to the Island especailly since now he has his quest to get off the island... which will ultimately turn out successful. If we imagine that he is told by someone that he must do something in the Tempest which unbeknownst to him was built by Richard or Ben or both to protect the island, he wouldn't know anything about it setting off a poisonous gas thus killing the DI and then Ben would be able to say that he had nothing to do with it because he technically didn't use it.
While some of you might see that as making little sense, it makes sense to me and that seems to be how the show goes, but I'm sure it'll play outand it'll be so clear that we'll all smack our heads and be like "Of course! It was all the bunnies!"

I think it was probably Locke that set it off but not on purpose. I don't think Locke would knowingly hurt people unless they refused to leave the island... I don't think he thinks in terms of black and white either, so to kill people including children would not be his style... but he seems to be very faithful to the point of being gullible when it comes to the Island especailly since now he has his quest to get off the island... which will ultimately turn out successful. If we imagine that he is told by someone that he must do something in the Tempest which unbeknownst to him was built by Richard or Ben or both to protect the island, he wouldn't know anything about it setting off a poisonous gas thus killing the DI and then Ben would be able to say that he had nothing to do with it because he technically didn't use it.
While some of you might see that as making little sense, it makes sense to me and that seems to be how the show goes, but I'm sure it'll play outand it'll be so clear that we'll all smack our heads and be like "Of course! It was all the bunnies!"

It's all about bunnies!:bunny::bunny::bunny:

It looks like there are some others who also think Locke might be involved somehow, even if unintentionally.

John Locke initiates it during a flash :)

Jacob.
He is the one who makes the decisions like that.
Richard said he didn't make the desision to kill the 18 army guys, he was told to. ( or words to that effect)
When Locke tells Richard "Jacob sent me" Richard believes him and tells Widmore to lower his gun.
to me that means Jacob is the one in the cabin/in charge at that time, and he is still in charge when the DI is there because he is in charge when 815 gets there.
Locke & Ben might like to think they are in charge, But we know who is.
Jacob.
Even if Ben was not the man in charge when the DI was purged, whoever was, was taking orders from Jacob.
(IMO of course)

we find out in a ben linus mini arc that others other than the "others" and the DI may be involved in molding ben as a young boy into the evil man he has become. and it may be a group we have already seen in the first 4 episodes.

I believe its Richard. He doesnt like it when another group takes over their island.

Locke doesn't seem to be as likely a possibility. Any new ideas now that we have a few more episodes under our belts?

Could it be Jacob through Richard to Ben?

what i was thinking...Jacob for sure, but who is the real decision maker behind poor Jacob?
he seems like a 'figurehead' that has no real power. (like Pres. Bush was)

How about it was Benry's idea, put thru Jacob, who then tells Alpert to execute it. So Benry maintains "denyablity".

After all, Benry DID murder his own Father, whose only real 'sin' seemed to be beer drinking and bringing him to the island.

maxaholic (http://forum.thefuselage.com/member.php?u=62243), i read your spoiler box...darn, that's been rumored, so not a big surprise....

i think there should be a contest as to how many uses of the word 'other' can be put into one real sentence.

There is of course, a flaw in my post.
The cabin wasnt built until Dharma times. (Goodspeed built it)
So if Jacob was in charge, I have to wonder, from where?

I only read the first few posts so I don't know if someone else said this ( if so sorry)
I think it was Richard, is it possible that Richard wanted Ben to kill his father? To become the leader of the Others??? Maybe it wasn't about a purge maybe it was about Ben killing his nasty father. As Ben pushed Locke to kill his own father? Once Locke returned with his father's body he was made the new leader of the Others right? That's when Ben went loopy and shot Locke..I took it as a test for Locke that Ben didn't think he would do.. and he really didn't he had Sawyer kill Cooper.. Maybe this is the sacrifice of the Island... wouldn't it be interesting if Thomas was really Ben ( time travelling as a 20 something got Claire pregnant) Flash forward to the future Aaron kills his nasty father Ben and becomes Leader??? Not a theory just an idea..

Hmm, I don't think Thomas was Ben. Remember the comment that Aaron's father would play no part in his life? Ben has been indirectly involved with Aaron a lot.

However, I do think it is interesting idea that the point of the purge wasn't about killing everyone else, it was about Ben killing his father.

what i was thinking...Jacob for sure, but who is the real decision maker behind poor Jacob?
he seems like a 'figurehead' that has no real power. (like Pres. Bush was)

How about it was Benry's idea, put thru Jacob, who then tells Alpert to execute it. So Benry maintains "denyablity".

After all, Benry DID murder his own Father, whose only real 'sin' seemed to be beer drinking and bringing him to the island.

maxaholic (http://forum.thefuselage.com/member.php?u=62243), i read your spoiler box...darn, that's been rumored, so not a big surprise....

i think there should be a contest as to how many uses of the word 'other' can be put into one real sentence.

Now that we've had 2.5 seasons with the name "Ben" and 0.3 of a season with the name Henry, I hope you can put the awful "Benry" name to rest.

I don't like the use of "Henry" or "Benry" either, but to each their own.

So, 3519273540, who did you vote for as responsible for the purge?

I voted for Widmore. When Ben was talking to Hurley about it, he noted that he was "not always" the leader of the others, and from what we know now, Widmore used to be the leader of the others and was forced out somehow by Ben.

I voted for Widmore. When Ben was talking to Hurley about it, he noted that he was "not always" the leader of the others, and from what we know now, Widmore used to be the leader of the others and was forced out somehow by Ben.

I agree that Widmore is definitely looking to be more and more likely...and we already know he is apparently okay with killing innocent people in mass numbers.

I don't think it was Ben because he was too busy gassing his father in the dharma van to hit the button to release the gas.. They did say that not all di was in the purge as some were spared...this is why I think it was someone from the DI who had access to that particular station or could go into the station without question.. my guess??? a Lostie.. Sawyer has access to anything as he's the new sherriff in town!! Why? because Locke fed him a line like he did when he killed Cooper.. Locke is an other now don't foreget and if Jacob said it had to be done then it has to be done..

pls don't hate or yell at me.. it's just a thought.. not looking to be proved right or wrong..

Carmelita, definitely an interesting idea that it is one of our LOST characters. It's painful to think of Sawyer doing that, but he definitely seems like he is in a position of power, so it's possible. As far as we have seen, though, Locke isn't yet in the same time as them--so perhaps whomever does it is influenced by someone else. (Jacob himself?)

Carmelita, definitely an interesting idea that it is one of our LOST characters. It's painful to think of Sawyer doing that, but he definitely seems like he is in a position of power, so it's possible. As far as we have seen, though, Locke isn't yet in the same time as them--so perhaps whomever does it is influenced by someone else. (Jacob himself?)


That's true about Locke bot being in the 70's yet- I want to see what happens when he gets off Hydra Island :)

Richard ordered the purge.
I remember the human sacrifice episode, "The Brig," where we see Locke and Sawyer facing Locke's Dad, Cooper.
You remember how Richard sat down with Locke, handed him Sawyer's folder, and encouraged Locke to get Sawyer to kill Locke's dad? Richard urged Locke to get Cooper dead, one way or the other.
I think we'll see Richard Alpert telling a younger Ben that the only way to become Leader of the Others is to kill his dad, and Richard and Ben will collaborate on the purge.

Richard ordered the purge.
I remember the human sacrifice episode, "The Brig," where we see Locke and Sawyer facing Locke's Dad, Cooper.
You remember how Richard sat down with Locke, handed him Sawyer's folder, and encouraged Locke to get Sawyer to kill Locke's dad? Richard urged Locke to get Cooper dead, one way or the other.
I think we'll see Richard Alpert telling a younger Ben that the only way to become Leader of the Others is to kill his dad, and Richard and Ben will collaborate on the purge.

It seems a bit like overkill for everyone to be killed, if Richard's only goal is Ben killing his father...I don't know, though, maybe he wanted to collect more bodies.

I agree that Widmore is definitely looking to be more and more likely...and we already know he is apparently okay with killing innocent people in mass numbers.

It;s possible, it could be one of the reasons Ben tricked him off the island?

It;s possible, it could be one of the reasons Ben tricked him off the island?

Ben's conversation with Hurley shows a real hatred of the leader who ordered the Purge, and we know he hates Widmore...good connection.

It;s possible, it could be one of the reasons Ben tricked him off the island?

Ben's conversation with Hurley shows a real hatred of the leader who ordered the Purge, and we know he hates Widmore...good connection.


This is true...I get a sick feeling when I look at Widmore and Hawkings. Their eyes are dead. Do you know what I mean? Like a shark. Now this could just be a great job on the part of the actors...but given the way Desmond was treated by Widmore and the seeming indifference towards well...everyone :D by Hawking IMO it was played out that way on purpose. I mean...if people can make Ben and Isabel (chick that branded Juliet) look warm and fuzzy? There is an issue. :roflmao: