Did anyone else notice or think the following when watching this episode?

Amy=Kate
Paul= Sawyer
Horace=Jack


Horace gets drunk and fights with Amy and flips out over finding that she kept the necklace of Amy's long lost husband. He fears she isn't over him.

Jack gets drunk and fights with Kate and flips out over finding out she's keeping a promise for her long lost lover Sawyer. He fears she isn't over him.

It was like i was being hit over the head with the parallels.

Horace hopes Amy doesn't think of or love her old love. And luckily for him Paul is really dead.

But, unluckily for Jack, Sawyer is alive and well.

I really liked that scene with Horace where Sawyer confessed his feelings for Kate, and how she'd impacted him, and how night after night he'd lain awake wondering if he'd made a mistake and thinking about her until the memories faded and he forgot the features of her face.

So sad and bittersweet.

It seems like he believes he's finally gotten over Kate and has moved on from being madly in love with Kate and yet....

I can't help but feel he's conning himself, and judging by the last reunion scene, so beautifully shot, it ain't over till the fat lady sings.

It seems like he believes he's finally gotten over Kate and has moved on from being madly in love with Kate and yet....

I can't help but feel he's conning himself, and judging by the last reunion scene, so beautifully shot, it ain't over till the fat lady sings.
I can't say I noticed the parallel, but perhaps that's what they intended.

Yes, obviously they're showing that he still has feelings for Kate. Which completely ticks me off. I so wish that was over.

I don't know that I think Sawyer & Juliet are the ideal couple, but at least they appreciate each other, for heaven's sakes. Kate never thought Sawyer was good enough. Ironic, considering the person she is. But, I shouldn't be getting into that here.

Since I absolutely love Sawyer and Kate together, this episode was good on many levels. I would agree that Sawyer still has feelings for Kate, although he may wish he doesn't anymore now that he's with Juliet.

The line that comes to mind is: "You can't help who you love."

Did anyone else notice or think the following when watching this episode?

Amy=Kate
Paul= Sawyer
Horace=Jack


Horace gets drunk and fights with Amy and flips out over finding that she kept the necklace of Amy's long lost husband. He fears she isn't over him.

Jack gets drunk and fights with Kate and flips out over finding out she's keeping a promise for her long lost lover Sawyer. He fears she isn't over him.

It was like i was being hit over the head with the parallels.

Horace hopes Amy doesn't think of or love her old love. And luckily for him Paul is really dead.

But, unluckily for Jack, Sawyer is alive and well.

I really liked that scene with Horace where Sawyer confessed his feelings for Kate, and how she'd impacted him, and how night after night he'd lain awake wondering if he'd made a mistake and thinking about her until the memories faded and he forgot the features of her face.

So sad and bittersweet.

It seems like he believes he's finally gotten over Kate and has moved on from being madly in love with Kate and yet....

I can't help but feel he's conning himself, and judging by the last reunion scene, so beautifully shot, it ain't over till the fat lady sings.

Main problem with the parallel is Kate is probably pregnant by Jack.

I think you're reaching.

Not everything on the show is about the ships.

I think you're reaching.

Not everything on the show is about the ships.


Tonights episode was ALL about the ships.

Sawyer seemed very sincere in his conversation with Horace and he seemed sincere in his scenes with Juliet. I think the sudden return of old feelings took him by surprise when he got the phone call and he'll have a lot to work through. I don't think it will be something cut and dried.

They recycled some classic Skate lines and scenes for Sawyer/Juliet. The fact that she could actually say "I love you" and it didn't have to be solicited. Sawyer's "I love you too" was so identical to when he said it to Kate in I Do that they could have spliced in the audio. And then followed by the camera panning up from the feet over them sleeping spooning. If I were a Skate fan I'd be kind of pissed that they stole some treasured scenes and recycled them.

They also took the musical theme from when Sawyer was watching Kate deliver Aaron and played it for the Sawyer/Juliet romantic scenes. So now it's their theme, I guess.

Tonights episode was ALL about the ships.

It was no more ALL about the ships than SNBH was (and I'm a Jater). It established a life on the island for the people left behind, and a major Lostie connection to the DI, and I suspect that will have many more ramifications than simply who loves whom.

To be honest I didn't even notice in those cheesy but sweet scenes. Everything pretty much disappeared when the reunion scene happened and everything was framed and scored so beautifully.

I truly think Sawyer believed what he was spouting to Horace, and then got sucker punched with Kate appearing back on the island. The writers know what they are doing.

The way he looked at Kate and she looked at him. The slow mo. The love theme playing. And how there was a pause in her appearing from behind Hurley and then she's revealed, and her face is in close up.

Sawyer's like: Oh god, now I remember what she looks like.

It was total awesomesauce. :biggrin: I love it when the creators really take their time over those big emotional moments.

Poor Juliet though, she's destined for a downer. Mark my words. I do hope that Sawyer tries to stick with her though, as long as he can before circumstances change things up again.

I agree not everything on the show is about the ships', but if anything this episode was more about Juliet and Sawyer then the dreaded triangle(although I'm dreading it's return). And Elizabeth Mitchell and Josh Holloway were both incredible in this episode not just in selling the relationship between Juliet and Sawyer but their individual scenes, Sawyer and Alpert. And the one that sticks out in my mind is Juliet at the picnic table noting that her house was over there. And that scene on the dock was incredible.

Sometimes I swear there are two different LOSTs playing to two different audiences. LOL

Yeah what was the point of giving that little triangle to Amy that perfectly matched the one we've had to put up with for years? I caught on to that immediately and rolled my eyes. Seriously writers?

He said three years it's long enough to get over someone but he realized his mistake the moment he saw her. All those feelings came rushing back. Now we just have to see how powerful his feelings for her really are. The same with Kate.

Now we just have to see how powerful his feelings for her really are. The same with Kate.Oh, let's not! ;) No, I'm sure you're right. I just hate the thought of it!

Oh, let's not! ;) No, I'm sure you're right. I just hate the thought of it!

haha sorry Bunnies, I gotta disagree. I get your pain though i've had to put up with stuff i've hated too. But we're almost at the end. Finally! :biggrin:

Let's face it, this episode was a shippy one. It started up a new romantic pairing in a nice but rushed manner, and yet still touched upon the ongoing J/K/S triangle and how it's affected James' character.

Why did the PTB even bother writing in another love triangle in such a packed episode, and give it so much air time if it wasn't meant to have some relevance on the themes of the episode? I seriously thought you couldn't get more blatant in terms of having parallels than the Amy/Horace/Paul thing.

I thought the Horace/James heart to heart was lovely and poignant and such a great lead up to the final scene where James discovers he was dead wrong. :biggrin:

Since everyone keeps mentioning the triangles that happen over and over, maybe that has something to do with the background of the war. Could two people have been fighting over the love of a third and that's what sparks the war?
Didn't Cleopatra have a love triangle? Just a thought.

Zoriah, many others have mentioned it as well because it really was pretty obvious and transparent.

Madge not really. Cleopatra was with Marc Antony after Caesar died :)

Sometimes I swear there are two different LOSTs playing to two different audiences. LOL

I have always said that the romance was added, mostly to broaden the viewer base and make the show appeal to different kinds of people. Not that it is totally unrelated to the plot, but, I know most of the people I know are the kind that don't really care about all the romances.

While I have never really cared who the hell Jack, Kate, or Sawyer ended up with (sometimes I kinda wished they would just end up in living in one house dating and fighting and lying to each other and not bothering anyone else). But, this Sawyer/Juliet relationship actually felt pretty natural and meaningful to me. I don't even see it as being very rushed... I've seen it coming since before the end of the last season finale.

But anyway, even though this is really the first romance I've cared at all about (except Des and Penny, thats different somehow) I am just waiting for poor Juliet to get her heart broken... YET AGAIN. :(

Zoriah, many others have mentioned it as well because it really was pretty obvious and transparent.

Madge not really. Cleopatra was with Marc Antony after Caesar died :)

Hmmm, did you say Caesar? :)

Juliet is dead. As soon as Sawyer convinced her to stay, it stood out to me as that moment which the character makes the wrong decision that totally will have disastrous consequences.

The appearance of Kate at the end of the episode solidified this for me. The only way Juliet survives now (IMO), is if she becomes Jack's new permanent woman... but I don't see her pulling a one-eighty that quickly.

But, this Sawyer/Juliet relationship actually felt pretty natural and meaningful to me. I don't even see it as being very rushed... I've seen it coming since before the end of the last season finale.


Agreed! I loved it -- I think Sawyer has never been better as a character than he was in those scenes. Nor has Josh, who -- for the first time -- seemed to convey a real peace within the character, likely because it was the first time Sawyer had actually found some.

And Zoriah, I guess it boils down to waiting and seeing. Perhaps it's where each viewer is coming from that dictates how the scene was perceived -- because I, personally, know of no one but you and some other Sawyer/Kate fans who saw a parallel... maybe because you wanted to. (Or maybe it really existed. Only Darlton really know, at this point, how it was to be interpreted.)

But it doesn't really matter what any of us think or want; in the end, what will be will be. And I think we can ALL agree that the most any of us can ask is that the characters we love ultimately end up happy.

Maybe Jack and Sawyer should be together. I certainly wouldn't complain. :drowsy:

The way he looked at Kate and she looked at him. The slow mo. The love theme playing. And how there was a pause in her appearing from behind Hurley and then she's revealed, and her face is in close up.

Sawyer's like: Oh god, now I remember what she looks like.


That's OTP baby ;)!. If something showed to me this episode, is that Sawyer and Kate are THE couple. Nobody can top them, not even Desmond and Penny.

Sometimes I swear there are two different LOSTs playing to two different audiences. LOL


Me, too!!;)

Why did the PTB even bother writing in another love triangle in such a packed episode, and give it so much air time if it wasn't meant to have some relevance on the themes of the episode? I seriously thought you couldn't get more blatant in terms of having parallels than the Amy/Horace/Paul thing.

I thought the Horace/James heart to heart was lovely and poignant and such a great lead up to the final scene where James discovers he was dead wrong. :biggrin:

All they really put in for the Horace/Amy/Paul triangle was the argument over the current man's jealousy over the woman holding onto something from the former man - in this case, her dead husband. It set the stage for the heart to heart with Horace and James, which I think was an important part of the episode.

I guess it also could go to show that even a mild-mannered reasonable man (by all accounts) like Horace could get upset by harbored objects of a former love. Guess Jack's not just an uptight meanie.

Or if you want to inject a lot of meaning into the Horace/Amy/Paul parallel, it's another hint that Kate could be pregnant by Jack.

I don't know if Sawyer will really drop Juliet like a hot potato. I think he's more self aware than many, and will get a chance to explore his conflicted feelings instead of act like the male version of the ping pong, and we won't be able to prejudge the resolution.

That's OTP baby ;)!. If something showed to me this episode, is that Sawyer and Kate are THE couple. Nobody can top them, not even Desmond and Penny.

I have to call blasphemy on that.
:)

I don't know if Sawyer will really drop Juliet like a hot potato. I think he's more self aware than many, and will get a chance to explore his conflicted feelings instead of act like the male version of the ping pong, and we won't be able to prejudge the resolution.

Juliet's death is going to solve that minor conflict.






...Sorry I'll shut up about it now.

Juliet's death is going to solve that minor conflict.






...Sorry I'll shut up about it now.


Everyone is so quick to assume Juliet is going to die. :rolleyes:

Juliet is dead. As soon as Sawyer convinced her to stay, it stood out to me as that moment which the character makes the wrong decision that totally will have disastrous consequences.

The appearance of Kate at the end of the episode solidified this for me. The only way Juliet survives now (IMO), is if she becomes Jack's new permanent woman... but I don't see her pulling a one-eighty that quickly.

That same moment gave me a little frisson of worry too. Juliet's a great characer and I've grown very fond of her so I very much hope the Juliet/James relationship isn't forced to an end by her death. Nevertheless, I think it will be brought to an end somehow as the Skate anvils in LaFleur were too numerous to ignore.
(Not that I'm complaining about that as I'm a big fan of Skate, but I would hate that relationship to cost us a good character like Juliet.)

I don't really get what was so magical about the reunion? Nothing happened! Does anyone remember on Friends when Joey was talking about "Smell the fart" acting? LOL that's kinda what the reunion looked like to me. I'm not being rude, I just don't see this magical dust floating around. Jack looked the happiest to see Sawyer so I thought that was kinda funny. I dont' doubt that everyone is going to have some awkard moments, but I hope the writers realize what they have with James and Jules.

I don't really get what was so magical about the reunion? Nothing happened! Does anyone remember on Friends when Joey was talking about "Smell the fart" acting? LOL that's kinda what the reunion looked like to me. I'm not being rude, I just don't see this magical dust floating around. Jack looked the happiest to see Sawyer so I thought that was kinda funny. I dont' doubt that everyone is going to have some awkard moments, but I hope the writers realize what they have with James and Jules.

:rotflmao2: Couldn't agree more.

I didn't see anything remotely romantic or magical happening. It was simply, "Whoa... they're back!" and "Whoa... we're back!"

I can't say I noticed the parallel, but perhaps that's what they intended.

Yes, obviously they're showing that he still has feelings for Kate. Which completely ticks me off. I so wish that was over.

I don't know that I think Sawyer & Juliet are the ideal couple, but at least they appreciate each other, for heaven's sakes. Kate never thought Sawyer was good enough. Ironic, considering the person she is. But, I shouldn't be getting into that here.

I agree. I did not really think about any parallel being shown, but maybe that was going on.

In my opinion, Sawyer most definitely still has feelings for Kate. He was just trying to make Horace feel like they could relate to each other's situation with the whole "i barely remember her face" bit. I truly hope whatever feelings Sawyer does have for Kate have dulled a bit over the years. I am kind of enjoying him and Juliet together. Juliet seems to be the only person on the island (from what I remember) that has been able to help keep Sawyer focused and level headed. He seems to appreciate the type of person she is. I can't stand Kate and her flip-flopping between Jack and Sawyer and secrets. But, we shall see where this goes.

Everyone is so quick to assume Juliet is going to die. :rolleyes:

Whoa srsly? I really hadn't read it anywhere yet. But roll your eyes all you want, I just take comfort knowing that I'm not the only one drawing the same conclusion, lol. :biggrin:

That same moment gave me a little frisson of worry too. Juliet's a great characer and I've grown very fond of her so I very much hope the Juliet/James relationship isn't forced to an end by her death. Nevertheless, I think it will be brought to an end somehow as the Skate anvils in LaFleur were too numerous to ignore.
(Not that I'm complaining about that as I'm a big fan of Skate, but I would hate that relationship to cost us a good character like Juliet.)

That's pretty much exactly how I feel. I don't want it to happen, I actually like Sawyer/Juliet. I just got the gut feeling when I saw that scene, and I'm going with it.

Whoa srsly? I really hadn't read it anywhere yet. But roll your eyes all you want, I just take comfort knowing that I'm not the only one drawing the same conclusion, lol. :biggrin:


Huh. Maybe it was just your posts I read. ;)

Huh. Maybe it was just your posts I read. ;)

LOLOL probably, I'm guilty of throwing it in there a couple times. :redface:

Sometimes I swear there are two different LOSTs playing to two different audiences. LOL
Amen, brother !!:yes:

Amen, brother !!:yes:

Sister. (*is female*) ;)

it's not con-man Sawyer and maverick Kate reuniting.
It's head of security Jim LaFleur and mom-for-three years Kate who are seeing each other again.
Kate is leaving a lie, but the last 3 years has affected her.
James is immersed in a lie, and his past 3 years have changed him too.

I don't think the writers will ignore the evolution of the characters over this 3-year period.

Did anyone else notice or think the following when watching this episode?

Amy=Kate
Paul= Sawyer
Horace=Jack


Yes, I noticed this, although I missed the Horace and Jack parallels that you pointed out.


Horace hopes Amy doesn't think of or love her old love. And luckily for him Paul is really dead.

Or is Paul completely dead...? Just saying...

There is also the slight possibility that the Horace/Amy/Paul triangle is actually a quadrangle, since Olivia Goodspeed is missing: Olivia/Horace/Amy/Paul. In that case, Horace asking LaFleur if someone can get over someone in three years might be him asking about Olivia...this has been speculated on the thread wondering where Olivia is (this option and about everything else under the sun that it could be!).


Not everything on the show is about the ships.

I believe the heart of the show is about love and what keeps people separated or united from each other. Romance falls within that theme.

Sometimes I swear there are two different LOSTs playing to two different audiences. LOL

Only two? :)

Since everyone keeps mentioning the triangles that happen over and over, maybe that has something to do with the background of the war. Could two people have been fighting over the love of a third and that's what sparks the war?

Interesting thought to tie the triangle into the mythology!

Also, while not one of the original numbers, LOST does seem to have a fondness of threes and triangles...

it's not con-man Sawyer and maverick Kate reuniting.
It's head of security Jim LaFleur and mom-for-three years Kate who are seeing each other again.
Kate is leaving a lie, but the last 3 years has affected her.
James is immersed in a lie, and his past 3 years have changed him too.

I don't think the writers will ignore the evolution of the characters over this 3-year period.

I agree.

Yeah what was the point of giving that little triangle to Amy that perfectly matched the one we've had to put up with for years? I caught on to that immediately and rolled my eyes. Seriously writers?

He said three years it's long enough to get over someone but he realized his mistake the moment he saw her. All those feelings came rushing back. Now we just have to see how powerful his feelings for her really are. The same with Kate.

I really did not think it resembled Jack/Kate/Sawyer at all. Paul and Horace were buddies. I didn't even find Sawyer and Kate's little "reunion" to have any spark of romance to it. The vibe I had was this:
Sawyer: What the hell...?
Kate: Uh, hey, this is weird. You're in a Dharma suit...Wuzzup?
Sawyer: What the hell...?
Kate: Hey, gimme a hug!

Can't y'all shippers stop reaching for something when there's nothing sometimes? I've seen this episode 3 times and all Kate does is a tentative smile, which Sawyer responds to with a "Damn, I'm stunned, I can't believe you're here"

OF COURSE he's happy to see her: our Losties have become a strange family and all care for each other. Kate's the equivalent of his girlfriend from high school, and I'm really annoyed with shippers trying to make this show into nothing more than an ultra epic disguised as a romance novel.

Please note I'm NOT a Jater. Jack's my bro, and Kate's too much crazy (BAD crazy, not sexy crazy) for him right now.

I really did not think it resembled Jack/Kate/Sawyer at all. Paul and Horace were buddies.

But...Jack and Sawyer are friends. Sure, they have disagreed on various points like many of our 815 crash survivors, but no more than most people. The various fandom wars perpetuate a false idea that they are not friends. Sawyer told Jack at one point that he was the closest thing he had to a friend; they have saved each others' lives. Jack was really happy to see him at the end of the episode.

I agree; Jack seemed genuinely happy and relieved to see Sawyer, and to just be back. He's been trying to get there for so long, and now he's finally here. Personally, I'm way more excited to see the way these two react to each other, than about the ships.

My interpretation was similar to Adam118's: there was shock there, plus a bittersweet sort of nostalgia and even relief, at seeing each other again. These people have been through so much together, they all have a bond.


And according to the preview for Namaste, Hurley and Sawyer whoop with joy as they hug. Seems everyone's happy to see each other again, not simply Sawyer and Kate.


However, I will concede that the whole '3 years Horace' set up was deliberately done to lead to the end moment, and much as I like Juliet, and find her perfect with James, I have a suspicion there'll be a lot of Kate related angst for him now. I don't think he's completely over her at all, no matter how implausible that seems to me, in terms of him having a mature, long-term relationship with Juliet. But that's LOST, eh? What would it be without the dragged out romantic tension and conflict?

Also, to end I'll say I'm thinking Jack has new priorities, a mission of sorts. Perhaps he'll be more interested in the big picture, than in romance? Or not! :D

I didn't notice any paralels the first time i watched the episode. But in the second time watching it Horace/Amy/Paul triangle reminded me of the situation with Juliet/Sawyer/Kate more than our old triangle.

I think this whole conversation between Horace and Sawyer was mirroring Sawyer's feelings.
Amy is not representing Kate.... she is representing Sawyer.
Sawyer is the one who lost Kate (Paul) and ended up with Juliet (Horace)
Horace and Amy were friends at the beginning. But after Paul is gone their friendship turned into a romantic partnership. Which is obviously the case with Suliet.
Sawyer and Juliet started this season as friends, as two ppl who trust and rely on each other. And during those 3 years their friendship has become much more.
In this episode Suliet was presented like a married couple... Horace and Amy are already a married couple.
Amy is still keeping something that belongs to Paul. Is it because she is still in love with her dead husband? Or could it be because she just wants to keep his memory alive in way? (Perhaps she doesn't want to forget what Paul looked like)

Sawyer was still keeping a little hope that Kate could come back one day. But is it because he is still in love with Kate?

Sawyer (Amy) was in the center of the whole drama, not Kate. In this episode, we have seen everything from Sawyer's POV. Not Kate's.
Like Paul, Kate was the passive player in this story.

Even the reunion was represented from Sawyer's POV. How Sawyer felt the minute he sees Kate? We watched Kate from Sawyer's eyes... If there is any romantic vibe in that scene, it's all coming from Sawyer. Not Kate.

JMO of course. ;)

Good post OZ! Everyone keeps talking about the amazing end scene. It wasn't so amazing, imo. It was all from Sawyer's pov and Kate barely gave a smirk. (I mean given that she's back to a place she never ever wanted to return to), I'm surprised she even mustered up that much! Whatever is going to happen, is all on Sawyer and no one else (unless he screws over Juliet, which he won't) :)

Interesting take, ozge! It makes more sense to me, especially your observation about the epi being Sawyer centric, and Amy being a representation of his past and present feelings over Kate and Juliet.

I still think Zoriah's take on the triangle parallel is more likely:

Horace freaked out about Amy keeping something from her past with Paul, i.e. the amulet.
Jack freaked out about Kate keeping something from her past with Sawyer, i.e. her promise - which she wouldn't even explain to Jack after the fact.

Horace got drunk and acted like a jerk.
Jack got drunk and acted like a jerk.

For me, the funniest thing about the whole triangle parallel is that they had Horace blowing up a tree! LOL
Who is the only other person on the series to have blown up a tree? Jack, of course, in that much-mocked scene at the end of S3.

If I hadn't spotted the triangle anvil before then, the tree assault would have definitely done it for me.

I did see a parallel, but thought it was more Amy = Sawyer, Paul = Kate and Horace = Juliet. Was 3 years long enough for Amy/Sawyer to have got over Paul/Kate and fallen for Horace/Juliet.

I know it isn't really the point, but Horace??? What was Amy thinking?

I know it isn't really the point, but Horace??? What was Amy thinking?

:rotflmao2:

But...Jack and Sawyer are friends. Sure, they have disagreed on various points like many of our 815 crash survivors, but no more than most people. The various fandom wars perpetuate a false idea that they are not friends. Sawyer told Jack at one point that he was the closest thing he had to a friend; they have saved each others' lives. Jack was really happy to see him at the end of the episode.

THAT is so true. and sawyer not letting jack go into the jungle for the helicopter alone in the 4th finale was very touching. of course, none of them like to be out of the loop, right?

OZ....brilliant!!!


how do we not know that the correlation between them is that amy can't give up on paul like kate can't give up on jack? horace like sawyer cannot deal with that.

had to at least try to throw out the other side of the triangle!:biggrin:

THAT is so true. and sawyer not letting jack go into the jungle for the helicopter alone in the 4th finale was very touching. of course, none of them like to be out of the loop, right?

OZ....brilliant!!!



Yeah, what the hell was Amy thinking with Horace? Maybe she found the "power" to be sexy.

Here's why I said Sawyer and Jack aren't friends: Thery're 2 guys that've grown to respect each other and get along with each other because their situation requires them to work together. Don't remember them hanging out much.

Honestly, I'm not going to get into an argument or whatever about them being friends, I wanted to clarify what I originally meant.

However, I'm sure they'll be bros in DHARMA time *thumbs up*:)


how do we not know that the correlation between them is that amy can't give up on paul like kate can't give up on jack? horace like sawyer cannot deal with that.

had to at least try to throw out the other side of the triangle!:biggrin:

how do we not know that the correlation between them is that amy can't give up on paul like kate can't give up on jack? horace like sawyer cannot deal with that.
Because Paul was Amy's secret, just as Sawyer was Kate's. Paul was lost to Amy, just as Sawyer was lost to Kate. Horace and Jack were the ones who walked away and then drank themselves into jealous stupors.

I really didn't think these two triangle parallels were that difficult to follow. :shrug:

Because Paul was Amy's secret, just as Sawyer was Kate's. Paul was lost to Amy, just as Sawyer was lost to Kate. Horace and Jack were the ones who walked away and then drank themselves into jealous stupors.

I really didn't think these two triangle parallels were that difficult to follow. :shrug:

I was joking.:rolleyes:

I think the parallel was obvious, and we're supposed to draw comparisons. Right down the length of time that Sawyer and Amy have had to get over their former flames. We knew Kate was coming, and we knew, or at least I did, that Sawyer was full of it. Of course he still has feelings for Kate.

I hope this isn't true for one reason...if the parallel is true then...

SPOILER INSIDE.



Will James then be the upcoming death with the rest of his story being told in FB's for the ratings? That would really SUCK. Yet it would rattle the hell outta both ships and the entire Lost community for that matter.

I hope not though, seriously.

We've all been wishin' and a hopin' for that end to the shape of doom...Better be careful what we wish for!

Because Paul was Amy's secret, just as Sawyer was Kate's. Paul was lost to Amy, just as Sawyer was lost to Kate. Horace and Jack were the ones who walked away and then drank themselves into jealous stupors.

I really didn't think these two triangle parallels were that difficult to follow. :shrug:

i was the one that posted that. adam just forgot to quote it.

it isn't that difficult to follow. oz showed a different side to the correlation and it just got me thinking about how the two triangle are a lot more the same than we speculated.

it is obvious, but it isn't set in stone.

I personally think ozge's triangulation parallel makes more sense. Sawyer is speaking from Amy's perspective. Kate isn't.

Horace is asking if 3 years is long enough to get over a ghost. You don't ask the ghost that question. You ask the person who's doing the "getting over".

You don't ask the ghost that question. You ask the person who's doing the "getting over".





OZ....brilliant!!!




i agreed with Oz.


had to at least try to throw out the other side of the triangle!:biggrin:




i was kidding.

I hope this isn't true for one reason...if the parallel is true then.

I expect that the parallel/anvils are done now. They served their purpose in this episode, and got their point across perfectly. Kate/Amy were holding on to the men they had lost. Sawyer/Paul were the ones lost. Jack/Horace were the jealous drunks. It was all set up to show the scene where Horace asks Sawyer "is three years long enough?", Sawyer muses on Kate and tries to convince himself that "absolutely", three years is long enough to get over her. Which we know is simply Sawyer lying to himself, as evidenced by his reaction to the phone call and his face when he sees her again. Case closed, IMO.

I personally think ozge's triangulation parallel makes more sense. Sawyer is speaking from Amy's perspective. Kate isn't.
Then what are we to assume that Sawyer is keeping secret about his past relationship with Kate? Amy hid the necklace. What is Sawyer hiding? Who is he hiding it from? And how does Jack factor in, if he isn't the Horace parallel, jealous of Kate coveting a secret about Sawyer?

well, when it's all said and done, horace concerned about amy coveting a rememberance of her husband is no match to kate lying to jack. kate kept a secret from jack "because he wouldn't want me to tell". EVERYTHNG that jack and kate had been through for the 3 years that they'd been off the island and she couldn't tell him what sawyer whispered to her, what she had been doing for him. for me, it has nothing to do with jack and kate, so why keep the secret. she thought he was dead. it wasn't very relationship-like! for amy to keep a memento of her deceased hubby....shame on her! she should be disgraced and her marriage to horace should be annulled. i thought it was a lame excuse for getting drunk and blowing up trees. the fact that he missed his son being born is proper punishment for being a fool.

the two men and their respective problems, there is no comparison.

I hope this isn't true for one reason...if the parallel is true then...

SPOILER INSIDE.



Will James then be the upcoming death with the rest of his story being told in FB's for the ratings? That would really SUCK. Yet it would rattle the hell outta both ships and the entire Lost community for that matter.

I hope not though, seriously.

We've all been wishin' and a hopin' for that end to the shape of doom...Better be careful what we wish for!





I really hope not...or maybe it'd be cool, who knows.

I personally think ozge's triangulation parallel makes more sense. Sawyer is speaking from Amy's perspective. Kate isn't.

Horace is asking if 3 years is long enough to get over a ghost. You don't ask the ghost that question. You ask the person who's doing the "getting over".


Hey Dany -

Oz's speculation makes a lot of sense, imo.

However, no-one knows anything for sure (except me, of course;)), so in the famous words of Mr. Nations, we will just have to wait, watch and see.......................

Then what are we to assume that Sawyer is keeping secret about his past relationship with Kate? Amy hid the necklace. What is Sawyer hiding? Who is he hiding it from? And how does Jack factor in, if he isn't the Horace parallel, jealous of Kate coveting a secret about Sawyer?

I'm really thinking that the parallel of this triangle hasn't really been revealed yet. I think that the parallel will be an object vs. an object parallel...maybe the necklace vs. ...ohh say...Kate's engagement ring? Just a theory I wanted to throw out there :)

Since everyone keeps mentioning the triangles that happen over and over, maybe that has something to do with the background of the war. Could two people have been fighting over the love of a third and that's what sparks the war?


Ben, Widmore and The Island?

good idea, Ei! necklace and engagement ring. ooooooo!

good idea, Ei! necklace and engagement ring. ooooooo!

No really...Amy kept the letter from Paul, just like Kate keeps the ring from Jack...making Sawyer the other man (ala Juliet). I'm just saying...Lost's parallel's have always been pretty straight forward...they may have been open to interpretation, but their parallels and mirroring have always been people with people, objects with objects, situations with situations...etc...

Thanks to everyone who said my theory was a good one. :)

Then what are we to assume that Sawyer is keeping secret about his past relationship with Kate? Amy hid the necklace. What is Sawyer hiding? Who is he hiding it from? And how does Jack factor in, if he isn't the Horace parallel, jealous of Kate coveting a secret about Sawyer?

Sawyer is hiding that he is still keeping a little hope that Kate might come back one day. He is keeping it from Juliet (Horace) and he is even lying to himself that he is totally over Kate (Paul)

When Juliet realizes that Sawyer has still some unresolved feelings for Kate, she will be in Horace's place, questioning whether 3 years is enough to get over someone or not.
And although this hasn't happened yet, i believe it's inevitable.

Thanks to everyone who said my theory was a good one. :)



Sawyer is hiding that he is still keeping a little hope that Kate might come back one day. He is keeping it from Juliet (Horace) and he is even lying to himself that he is totally over Kate (Paul)

When Juliet realizes that Sawyer has still some unresolved feelings for Kate, she will be in Horace's place, questioning whether 3 years is enough to get over someone or not.
And although this hasn't happened yet, i believe it's inevitable.


Oz,

I do like your theory. Wonder why some find this one so hard to believe??:confused: It makes just as much sense, if not more, than any others floating around!

Any unresolved feelings he may still have for Kate, are solely on him. We've been shown time and time again that Kate didn't care about going back, even after she knew he was alive, so she is not there for him. And if she ever did care about Sawyer, she will see how much he's changed and how truly happy Juliet does make him, and she will leave them alone. Not to mention the damage it would do to her character if she were to start acting like the island ping-pong ball again! :rolleyes: However, we've been shown that she is totally different too. And I don't think Kate is the one with the problem. She dealt with all of that, and moved on. Sawyer will need to get over whatever lingering feelings and insecurities he may have, and due to the amazing change in him, I think he will have no problem doing so. Juliet may question if he's really over Kate, and I think he will assure her in no uncertain terms that he ABSOLUTELY is!:biggrin:

nice posts!