When Ben goes into his secret closet tunnel, he summons the smoke monster by letting the water out of the drain. Does this imply that Smokey can't pass through water? And like the wicked witch, I wonder if he could be defeated by water? Another Wiz reference??

So you think he was expected to come through Ben's house?

I don't think he/she/it did that when Ben summoned it last time. He came through the jungle. And Ben himself was expecting him to come out of the jungle,like he pointed out to Sun.

I think what Ben did was to wake him up by disturbing his original habitat, what happens to be

WATER.

Now, this brings me back to the theory I just posted that Smokie is actually APEP, an evil demon from egytpian mythology.

He was, by the way, represented as a giant WATER snake.

He was also called 'Soul Eater' and Serpent of REBIRTH'....

Is there anything else to say?;)

I was just wondering how the heck they get Smokey to go back into the water!

So you think he was expected to come through Ben's house?

I don't think he/she/it did that when Ben summoned it last time. He came through the jungle. And Ben himself was expecting him to come out of the jungle,like he pointed out to Sun.

I think what Ben did was to wake him up by disturbing his original habitat, what happens to be

WATER.

Now, this brings me back to the theory I just posted that Smokie is actually APEP, an evil demon from egytpian mythology.

He was, by the way, represented as a giant WATER snake.

He was also called 'Soul Eater' and Serpent of REBIRTH'....

Is there anything else to say?;)

Thanks Fierro. I was wondering earlier who the snake god was, then found it. I read about the soul eater aspect of Apep, but the water snake part is news to me. I am learning about mythology through Lost. We never studied it much in school.

I agree that Smokey sounds like Apep, but I am still pondering some things. Apep was mostly a night deity. Have we seen much of Smokey in the daylight? And why was he called Cerberus on the blast door map? Cerberus was a dog.

Yeah, I also saw it as him disturbing Smokey. I just thought that the standing water was keeping Smokey from entering Ben's domain, and that releasing the water downward drove him out in the other direction, towards the jungle.

It was kind of a giggle moment for me amidst the tension of the scene when the water gurgled down the drain.
I agree about the water though. It's Smokey's natural habitat and draining it disturbs him. What I found really interesting is when Ben previously summoned Smokey, it pretty much did what he wanted it to do but, this time, it made Ben come to the Temple.

Thanks Fierro. I was wondering earlier who the snake god was, then found it. I read about the soul eater aspect of Apep, but the water snake part is news to me. I am learning about mythology through Lost. We never studied it much in school.

I agree that Smokey sounds like Apep, but I am still pondering some things. Apep was mostly a night deity. Have we seen much of Smokey in the daylight? And why was he called Cerberus on the blast door map? Cerberus was a dog.

Yeah, I also saw it as him disturbing Smokey. I just thought that the standing water was keeping Smokey from entering Ben's domain, and that releasing the water downward drove him out in the other direction, towards the jungle.
dharma called it Cerberus because it was like a guardian dog protecting the island and the Temple...

And I don't think this version of Apep has to follow EXACTLY the original egyptian tales.

So, Ben "unleashed" Smokey by draining water, suggesting that Smokey can't move through water. . . but haven't we seen Smokey in the rain? Bad things always happen in the rain, though. . .

I'm not sure the suggestion was that Smokey can't move through water, becuase he doesn't actually rise from that hole. Ben expected him to come through the jungle.

I found that scene pretty weird though. It was like Ben pulled the drain in a dirty bathtub. Sort of a strange way to summon Smokey.

I don't know but that was an odd scene! It looked like he pulled the plug or drain and all the water disappeared down the hole. There had to be a point to that scene of how Ben summons Smokie.

I agree... the rain is usually a sign to watch out for bad things to happen, including Smokey.

well, smoke does travel through the rain but gets filtered pretty heavily when travel through standing water, Just ask Michael Phelps. ;)

Smokey often has the electric pulses coursing through it. I dont believe electricity and water generally like eachother.

Something that may be of interest as well...Dogs in a lot of cultires especially mesopotamia were believed to carry the souls of the dead across bodies of water.

I found that scene pretty weird though. It was like Ben pulled the drain in a dirty bathtub. Sort of a strange way to summon Smokey.

I agree. My mom and laughed really hard at this scene. What I wonder is when Ben pulls the plug releasing the dirty water how does it get filled back up again?

Smokey can't travel through water, which is why they did the experiments on the other Island and also why they go back and forth in a submarine. He's a quantum computer made of nanobots--ala Fred Hoyle.

I agree. My mom and laughed really hard at this scene. What I wonder is when Ben pulls the plug releasing the dirty water how does it get filled back up again?

It's good to know I'm not the only one who wondered that. :biggrin: BTW, I love your siggy!

I'm not sure myself. We have this relatively large, well-built archway with a carved stone door and steps leading down, only to have the space turn into a snaked, narrow passageway with roots and loose rocks that must be traversed on hands-and-knees. The hollow where the muddy pool is found looks like it's made of boulders tumbled haphazardly over one another as well. Maybe the stone door once opened out onto a finished stone hallway like those found beneath the temple, but has long since collapsed into a little hollow in the hillside. If this is the case, perhaps the whole ordeal of reaching the pool and draining the water was not the original way of getting the Monster's attention.

Also, we don't know that Ben always has to drain the pool to summon the Monster. A rock or something might have merely clogged the "speaking tube" since his last visit, allowing it to fill in with groundwater.

This reminds me of the Hollywood ghost classic The Uninvited [1944], with Ray Milland, Gail Russell, and Ruth Hussey.

A brother and sister, new owners of an old house on England's Southwesten coast, suspecting they have a ghost, come two a revelatory occurrence which prompts the brother to say, "Pamela, we haven't a ghost. We've got two of them."

I agree that standing water is a barrier Smokey cannot cross. We also have Jacob who cannot pass through the pulverized, granular stuff that encircles his Cabin.

Smokey can't travel through water, which is why they did the experiments on the other Island and also why they go back and forth in a submarine. He's a quantum computer made of nanobots--ala Fred Hoyle.

Except for the fact that the Producers have explicitly ruled out Smokie as a nano-cloud. While I don't wholly endorse Fierro's Apep theory, I agree that Smokie's origin is more spiritual/fantastical than science.

Since Ben had to pull the drain plug, do you think this means that every time we've seen a visit from Smokey (encounter with Locke, Eko, ripping off the French guy's arm, etc.) that it was manually summoned and that it doesn't have the power to move about at will?

Remember what Michael Emerson told us about Smokey? "I think it all has something to do with metallic dust. I think the smoke monster is connected to that ring of powder that surrounds Jacob's cabin. They've established that there are supermagnetic forces at work on the Island, so what better medium for those forces to work through than through fine filings of metal.")]
From http://spoilerslost.blogspot.com/2009/04/latest-from-kristin-sawyer-kate-finale.html

What if somehow the water triggers smokey, lets the electricity spread to the dust and powers him up.
Basically waking him up.

I agree... the rain is usually a sign to watch out for bad things to happen, including Smokey.
Apep was the demon of storms, among other things....;)