I love the show and am a big fan of this and other websites that allow us fans the opportunity to feel and be an integral part of its energy.

But I can't believe for one moment that so many fans and board posters have bought into last night's show and the "answers" it provided... I mean don't get me wrong, last nights episode was excellent. And the it did provide answers to the hatch and Desmond and Dharma.

My point is that the whole subplot that is the hatch/desmond/dharma is exactly that-- a subplot, a tangent... And a pretty cool one I might add... I love where it is going, but it is not going anywhere that will end up mattering in the big LOST storyline...

If you look at the Lost as a story line from point A (seattle, wa) to point B (boston, ma) then this whole desmond/hatch/dharma is like a side-trip down to the Grand Canyon. (a cool little sidetrip and worth taking, but certainly not necessary to get from seattle to boston.

Thats what Dharma will turn out to be.. And in 4 years we will be reminiscing about "remember that hatch stuff with the logo and the weird guy".

Just like in Star Wars final scene, "Luke, stay on target".

Sorry I got cut off, so to finish...

Does anyone think the brilliant writers/producers/creators of this series would all of sudden provide us with so many answers in the third episode of season 2? They have been so deliberate to date and to now just unload like this. I don't think so.

And to do it so clumsily. I mean they have been Masters of Subtlety and to all of a sudden become so blatantly obvious.. Creating a 'secret organization' that just happens to be researching enough topics to fit each of the 'islands' mysteries into a category... ok project 1 explains this, then project 2 explains this, and meterology can explain this..

Just way to neat and tidy a fix to have so soon..

I think it is a brilliant distraction technique and sooner than later they will jerk our attention back into focus.

i hope i'm right.. it would be such a letdown if this is it

I agree whole-heartedly. There's more going on here than meets the eye! The fact that the hatch concept was thought up after the show was already running (according to something I read from TPTB, sorry I don't have the reference handy), and the fact that Jack was initially supposed to die in the pilot, makes me think all this Dharma and Hanso stuff isn't the real explanation.

Sorry I got cut off, so to finish...

Does anyone think the brilliant writers/producers/creators of this series would all of sudden provide us with so many answers in the third episode of season 2? They have been so deliberate to date and to now just unload like this. I don't think so.

And to do it so clumsily. I mean they have been Masters of Subtlety and to all of a sudden become so blatantly obvious.. Creating a 'secret organization' that just happens to be researching enough topics to fit each of the 'islands' mysteries into a category... ok project 1 explains this, then project 2 explains this, and meterology can explain this..

Just way to neat and tidy a fix to have so soon..

I think it is a brilliant distraction technique and sooner than later they will jerk our attention back into focus.

i hope i'm right.. it would be such a letdown if this is it


I agree with the clumsy part. I've been telling anyone who will listen that the orientation
video is a bunch of crap. It's either the start of a downward spiral of writing and creativity
or else it's meant to deceive the viewer. I wasn't too happy about it. I hope you are right!

I agree also. I've said it before and I'll say it again, the so-called answers this episode provides would kill the show off in rapid fashion and would be far below the creative abilities of these writers. The whole social experiment mumbo jumbo has been there, done that in both textbooks, fictions, and movies. Not to say its not fun to speculate about what these things could hypothetically mean momentarily, but, even if those specs are correct, I don't think their influence on the future of the island or lostaways will be as critical or comprehensive as people think.

Another agree´er here.... In the long run we will see this whole thing as as side step in overall storyline as someone earlier wrote....

My point is that the whole subplot that is the hatch/desmond/dharma is exactly that-- a subplot, a tangent... And a pretty cool one I might add... I love where it is going, but it is not going anywhere that will end up mattering in the big LOST storyline...


Oh, I agree with you 100%. I don't think that anything on LOST is "what you see is what you get", and don't take any 'answers' as real answers. Plus, with the writing being admittedly fluid writing, I don't think that any LOST fan theorist has hit the nail on the head completely. But, it sure is fun to speculate. ;)

There is a fine line to balance with this show.

Firstly, LOST is on network prime time, not the sci-fi channel, so the expectations are slightly different with a more generalized demography. I would contend that some, even many of us on this board are of a very analytical nature, and enjoy deep discussion of the Island legend, science/pseudo-science, allegory, religion/pseudo-religion, etc. that comprises the background of the story. However, many prime time network viewers are out to watch a show simply for a good drama and plotlines, or to latch on to characters, and do not care about all of the incremental thinking or discussion points. To satisfy this demographic, some of the plotlines must be forwarded, possibly at the expense of what some might deign as smooth transitions of scientific theory.

Personally, I would rather the plot plod forward more slowly whilst we slowly deconstruct the legend of the Island, a slow steady slope of knowledge. But that would be unfair to all of the audience, to those whom are watching for the plot/characters. Conversely, if the plot is too fast, too much will be revealed, and the science/legend/religion will appear shoddy and rushed and not anchor a solid story foundation, and it would not carry the intrigue that it does.

In the end, let's be happy that the creators and actors of LOST provide a wonderful show which amalgamates all of the above elements in an atypical, almost unique blend. They will continue to push the envelope of 'typical' network drama, and expose the general audience to more and more of the sceince, legend, religion and I believe they will continue to satisy all comers with this mixture. To date, this show has exceeded all expectations for a science fiction based show based on a survival drama (or is it a survival drama with scientific/religious elements?).

Typically, this genre is relegated to poorly propogated fringe, cable channels, and we probably wouldn't be talking about this right now.

It is indeed a fine balance, and they are executing wonderfully.
-Mang

I agree Stickmang with your post.

And I was very careful not to present this in any way as a criticism of the show's intelligencia.... I think they are doing a splendid job as well..

My point was to try and make sure all the brilliant posters out there don't spend too much time chasing a dead end.

I too much enjoy, like you, the slow disection of the material.

This was just too much of an explanation for so many of the questions. And the superb writers wouldn't do that to us.

Remember all the time and energy people spent on the Black Rock? And it turned out to be a ship?

Things might not be what they seem.

Remember that all important truths are simple.

The problem is stripping them all down to find the simple truth.

Right now this is what we have to work with though. And I do not thing for a minute that the swan project or the Dharma Initative is the purpose behind whats going on with the island and the lostaways on it.

I think it's just another piece of a much larger puzzle. The island, and the numbers twisted the project to it's own means. Now that sounds like crazy ol Hurley talk to you right now. But mark my words, they are going to find something much deeper by the time they're done exploring the hatch, something thats going to make what we've seen small. Dharma got in over it's head when it set up the project on the island. Maybe it feel victim to something already there, maybe it opened up or started whatever has been crashing planes, boats, etc into the island for God knows how long. But Dharma isnt in any stretch of the imagination the final answer.

If the show keeps going on this tangent it will only last 3 - 4 season. I feel Lost jumped the shark with the Orientation Episode.

I don't feel anything in that episode would lead us to believe that Darhma is responsible for the strange happenings on the island only that they are studying them. To me orientation wasn't an attept to answer the mysteries of the island only to show us that someone else is looking into them as well. Remember how the video pointed out the electromagnetism on the island but they weren't the cause of it so the mystery is still there.

Right now this is what we have to work with though. And I do not thing for a minute that the swan project or the Dharma Initative is the purpose behind whats going on with the island and the lostaways on it.

I think it's just another piece of a much larger puzzle. The island, and the numbers twisted the project to it's own means. Now that sounds like crazy ol Hurley talk to you right now. But mark my words, they are going to find something much deeper by the time they're done exploring the hatch, something thats going to make what we've seen small. Dharma got in over it's head when it set up the project on the island. Maybe it feel victim to something already there, maybe it opened up or started whatever has been crashing planes, boats, etc into the island for God knows how long. But Dharma isnt in any stretch of the imagination the final answer.

YES! I like to think this as well. And on the topic of us spending too much time analyzing dead ends, hey, it's what we do best! The theorizing over these things is what keeps The Fuselage alive... even though sometimes (and most of the time) it leads us nowhere. Remember last week in the Adrift forum, where we all racked our brains to explain the prop differences between MoSMoF and Adrift? And then this week on Orientation, the props are back to the way they were in MoSMoF? I don't know what any of it means, but I'm enjoying the ride (and wasting a ridiculous amount of time on these forums... I'm so addicted... I need help!)

LOST is going to run for 5 years, if not longer. No question about it. It is ABC's baby, and there's too much money to be had in syndication. I think they're going through the Sophomore Slump, and the dialogue is as hokey as ever - Desmond -"What ever happened to that girl ?" Jack- "I MARRIED Her !"

good topic..and great discussion...

I think speculation will always loose out to whatever the brains of the "Lost" writers can come up with.
I just hope the excellent acting, situations and storyline from season 1 holds up this season 2.

I think TPTB has stated misleading viewers is considered important now, since too many spoilers was getting out.

I dont mind not knowing whats gonna happen, but somehow as a viewer i need the assurance that whatever im presented with in each episode as im watching, has a starting point, a middle and an end.

I think they're going through the Sophomore Slump... and the dialogue is as hokey as ever

Soopafresh,

It's my opinion that what you might see as a slump, I perceive as a concerted change in short-term direction to setup the season. I believe LOST had to take a more direct approach to answering some questions and forward the plotline so as not to alienate the "general" audience/demographic in network prime time; remember, not everybody is as analytical and delving as are we, the ravenous 'lagers Also, the ensemble cast is fractionated, and therefore we are seeing more stories in different areas of the island, and all of the associated backstories..

It's a difficult balance to provide just enough answers, forward the plot, develop the legend, fill in the background, reveal the characters (especially when fractionated), and add enough ancillary data, symbols, allegory, mystery and red herrings to keep us all in heavy discussion mode. And did I mention thehilarious Hurley "1-liners" and Sawyer's "Book of Sarcastic Names"?

Let's agree to disagree, and remain respectful of each other's opinions, and remain true to the 'lage.

-Mang

Another thing that really gets me is the lack of communications equipment in the hatch. What's so important about them not being able to communicate with the outside world? Forget for a moment the fact that it'd be too convenient for the Lostaways. Why wouldn't Hanso give them the ability to communicate with them in an emergency? Something truly fishy is going on.

yeah and people still havent rationalized the MONSTER or whatever it is on the island or the fact that WALT HAS POWERS!

the monster could be dharmas.
but walt having the ability to materialize what hes thinking among other things such as esp etc.
i mean dharma or hanso doesnt really touch on that subject, also the others... or why the black rock is stranded in the MIDDLE Of the island.... i mean so many things are pushed out of peoples minds as they travel down the path of explaining everything through a subplot, im sure hanso and dharma are important but it aint everything and if they plan to continue the show... its barely even beginning..

thats all i have to say

Another thing that really gets me is the lack of communications equipment in the hatch. What's so important about them not being able to communicate with the outside world? Forget for a moment the fact that it'd be too convenient for the Lostaways. Why wouldn't Hanso give them the ability to communicate with them in an emergency? Something truly fishy is going on.

Maybe they´re using this Shaft for experiments, so there´s other shaft for communications.... u know....

I think part of the brilliance of this show is that it can work on different levels.

For instance, I'm sure there are faithful viewers who enjoy this show but have no idea who the philosophers Locke and Rousseau were or how they relate to the characters sharing their names, or who BF Skinner was. The show is written so that it can be taken simply at face value and be intriguing.

But then there are also the deeper levels - the names, the sometimes obscure references, the visual clues - that keep people like us fascinated.

Soopafresh,

It's my opinion that what you might see as a slump, I perceive as a concerted change in short-term direction to setup the season. I believe LOST had to take a more direct approach to answering some questions and forward the plotline so as not to alienate the "general" audience/demographic in network prime time; remember, not everybody is as analytical and delving as are we, the ravenous 'lagers Also, the ensemble cast is fractionated, and therefore we are seeing more stories in different areas of the island, and all of the associated backstories..

It's a difficult balance to provide just enough answers, forward the plot, develop the legend, fill in the background, reveal the characters (especially when fractionated), and add enough ancillary data, symbols, allegory, mystery and red herrings to keep us all in heavy discussion mode. And did I mention thehilarious Hurley "1-liners" and Sawyer's "Book of Sarcastic Names"?

Let's agree to disagree, and remain respectful of each other's opinions, and remain true to the 'lage.

-Mang
mang u put it right in a nutshell...luv it....they have to keep us at the lage or die-hards happy and in turn win new losties.... keep up the great posts...
skybluelost:-)