Long Lost List Episode Observations

The Long Lost List is an encyclopedic website catalogueing Lost episode trivia on symbols, clues, mysteries, lit, film, history, philosophy, soci-psych references and all other things Lost. The site is still under development.

Data will be collected from this and other episode threads and added to this outline for inclusion in the Long Lost List, an upcoming Lost website encyclopedia of show trivia. Only fact based data that is observable in episodes and/or confirmed by VIPs is included in the LLL. Credit will be given to your username if we copy your original material.

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General Episode and Character Info
Walt said, ""they're coming and they're close" ???

Unsubtitled Translations

Flashback Cast

Red Shirts & Supporting Cast

Secrets

Character Connections

Visions, Hallucinations and Dreams

Character Info:
--> Symbolic tattoos, clothing or jewelry
--> Meaning of names
--> Birthdays / ages
--> Employment history

Philosophy & History References

Literature, Film & TV References

Art, Graphic Art and Comics



Songs of Lost

Religious References

Weird Props and Recurring Imagery
--> Airplanes (toys and real)
--> Amputron 4200
--> Batteries
--> Boxes,
--> Bronze Cuckoo - Walt's little birdie
--> Butterflies & Moths
--> Compass
--> Creepy Dolls
--> Eyes
-->Globes
-->Green Lantern Comic Book
-->Handcuffs
-->Lamps
-->Locke's Dog Whistle
-->Peanut Butter
-->Posters
-->Sawyer's Letter
-->Suspicious Pen Sightings
-->Tarot
-->Rain, Water, Death and Violence
--> Other

Parallel Plots & Recurring Themes
--> Broken Families
--> Character Parallels
--> Free Will vs. Fate
--> Reasons for Being on the Plane
--> Recurring Phrases
--> Other

Numbers References

Games

Accidents

Misc. Symbolism

OUTLINE CONTINUED ON NEXT POST...

OUTLINE CONTINUED


Major Lost Mysteries:
--> Monster / Security System
--> Polar Bear
--> Hatch
--> Whispers
--> Others
--> Black Rock

Misc. Unsolved Mysteries

People Puzzles:
--> Sceve: the Mystery of Scott and Steve
--> Walt's Special Powers?
-->Clues to Locke's Mysterious Condition
-->Clues to the Death of Dr. Christian Shephard

Character Travels & Island Exploration

Maps & Landmarks

Lost Timeline

Geography of Lost (Places They've Been or Mentioned)

Booze

Drugs

Sex

Food

Weapons

Fights

Bondage / Captivity

Sickness/Injury

Hygiene

Automobiles

Island Technology / Inventions

The Morgue: Body Count and Funeral Rites

Goofs



Let the observing begin.

Seeings as the mods aren't putting up a forum for Collision, I will post this here so we can start doing what we do.

There were a lot of interesting shots for screencap hunting to keep us busy for this long down time, thank goodness.

Ana's mom being her boss caught me off guard, as did Sayid's reaction. I loved it.

In the Canadian preview


Michael is telling ? that there are glass doors that slide down out of the ceiling of the Hatch if there is an explosion. The term Sudden Awakening is used before a passionate kiss between Jack and Kate. She steps away with a shocked look on her face. It appears that Locke doesn't get the numbers input in time and we see the timer go to all 0's

Bondage / Captivity

Sayid is tied up by (presumably) Libby, under Ana's direction, after Bernard refuses to do it. Interestingly, he's later set free by Ana herself, after a heart-to-heart about how (in my interpretation anyway) they're held captive by their pasts...like most of the islanders.

Sickness/Injury

Sawyer's gone septic by the time he gets back to the hatch...apparently he has a high fever and Jack seems worried...though he may be more worried about how Kate's cuddling Sawyer....

As far as injury goes, Ana does shoot the person who shot her. Bang. Dead.

Incredible episode...hard to think of anything that could have been done better. I'm impressed almost beyond words...muchos kudos to all involved!!!

WIF...awesome on your preview detail...I will need to re-watch the preview as it went by too quickly.

Yep, lots of potential clues to look at:

books behind Ana in shrink's office
"WW II" in clue on Locke's crossword puzzle (there's more to find on that one)
blue candle in hatch bunker where Sawyer was placed

Memorable lines:
"I'm not doing it for him. I'm doing it for me" (Eko to Ana)
"I feel dead" (Ana to Sayid)
"............we're both...dead" (Sayid to Ana - it could have been
"what good would it do to kill you..we're both already dead")

"Echo Park" mentioned in LA flashback (a nod to Eko? clue to Island mysteries?)

We saw a closeup of Bernard's ring-less left hand but didn't get to see Rose give his ring back...I'm sure we will though.

Did anyone recognize anyone in the flashbacks as people we've already seen?

ETA Sorry for not including the outline headings...I'll try harder next time.

Reunions:
Jin/Sun
Michael/Vincent
Bernard/Rose
Jin-Michael-Sawyer/Losties

Morgue: Shannon:crybaby: (poor Sayid)

Numbers:

Anna's response to domestic call, 8 Adam 16

did anyone else catch that when the captain (anna's mom) and anna were looking at the guy through the one way glass at the police station, the captain told anna he was picked up in "ecko park"

Caps to look for
In shrinks office - books, Ana's t-shirt, lamp, skyline, stapler, folder on desk etc.

In police station - When Ana is coming back to work she passes a lot of interesting things on the walls. Pik of knives, wanted posters etc.

Golf ball that falls into the water trough had writing/numbers on it

When Ana and Raggs are driving there is a sign they focus on for a while.

Locke is doing a crossword puzzle in the Hatch. I saw "What is Enkido's friend", then you see him writing LAA

Jack grabs something from a yellow mug in the shower.

Ana is sitting with the gun to her face and there is a good shot of her ring.

Books in Desmonds bed.

Another shot of the mural and books on shelves.

Jason's t-shirt in the bar has an interesting emblem on it.


General Episode and Character Info

Michael asks Ana if she is crazy!!!

Ana tells her gang that she KNOWS WHAT SHE IS DOING. I was sure this was going to be brought up again, but it must have went over my head.

Ana was off work and going to the shrink, due to being involved in a officer involved shooting???

Ana and her mother speak spanish to each other when the topic gets personal.

Ana is disappointed her mother/Capt is putting her on desk duty. Ana says that she needs to be back on the street. Her mother reminds her that she doesn't want any special treatment (pull strings for her) indicating that would be normal procedure.

Ana asks for a transfer so her mom caves and gives her a car??? When Ana asks her mom why she is doing this (cuz she's her mom or boss) her mom replies, "both"

Turns out the Cap't has told Raggs to take it easy on her first day and go to a safe neighborhood. They go to Westwood. (Isn't that the name of the town from the OJ theory thread??)

A fellow cop tells Ana she has an important call in the bullpen. Her mother warns her it's cuz they bought her a cake, and tells her to act surprised.

Jack tells Kate to keep her left arm straight to make the shot go further??

Jack insinuates that because he's a doctor, that he's a good golfer. "Golf is accuracy"

When Eko takes Sawyer back, he says he's not doing it for Sawyer, he's doing it for himself.

Raggs asks Ana if she wants him to kick Danny's ***, and she says that it's better this way.

Ana tells Libby that she won't let Sayid go because she killed someone he loved???
How does she know, we just found out. Sayid didn't even probably know till he said it???

When Michael is giving Sayid water, Sayid asks where Walt is. When M tells him that the others took him from the raft, Sayid realizes that Shannon was telling the truth about seeing Walt and knowing he was alone and in danger.

What did Jack and Kate use to decide who went first at golf? It was red, but I didn't catch it.

Jack shoots his first ball into the jungle and won't take a drop (pride?)

Jack holds the golf club like a weapon when he sees Eko appear with Sawyer on his shoulders.

Jack throws Sawyer into the shower to reduce his fever. He tells Kate to go get the Effloxocin?? (little white pills), alcohol, ........??

Eko seemed to recognize the Dharma logo.

Bernard says he wants to leave to go see his wife. Ana mentions he owes her for keeping him alive. She uses the term, "Cut me some slack"

Sayid says that Ana has no plan, just guilt and a gun. Loved that scene.

Ana decides to go it on her own so she can release Sayid and make everyone happy.

She asks Mike if they have ammo back at their camp. She tells him to get her a big pack, jeans, socks................???? and she will let his friend go when he returns with all that.

Libby tells Ana that she can't live out here all alone, which Ana replies, "I'm already alone" (reference to losing Danny, job and baby??)

When Ana and Raggs return to the police station, there is a big Caution sign (Raggs disposition?/opposite of Ana's) He uses the nickname "A O" and uses the term, "draw down"

Eko tells Jack that it was an accident that Ana shot Shannon.

Kate tells Jack that she can give Sawyer the pills, like she's had experience. (mother?)

Jack didn't look too happy when Kate was cuddling Sawyer and kissing his forehead.

Jack tells her she did a nice job and that he never learned the whispering in the ear trick in medical school.

Libby tells Ana that she is not the best judge of character. She mentions Ana throwing Nathan in the pit.

Ana has a scratch on her cheek like Jack did???

Eko says no matter what he says it will make Jack angry. He asks Jack what he wants.....peace, revenge, justice?? He says that Ana Lucia made a mistake. Jack recognizes the name, realizes they are tailenders in dire straights like them and agrees to go without guns.

Sayid tells Ana about torturing many men and hearing their voices at night. (we know what Sayid hears in the whispers)

Sayid asks Ana if she is going to shoot him. Ana asks if she should. Sayid says maybe she should, maybe she was meant to. (Destiny)

Ana tells Sayid she is a cop, then corrects herself and says she used to be.

Ana tells Sayid that all she heard was a pop and thought she was dead. She then tells him she feels dead.

When Ana releases Sayid she tells him to go ahead and kill her, that she deserves it. Sayid says, "What good would it be to kill you, if we're both already dead"

Kate is soothing Sawyer and she tells him that he is home. (Sawyer said they were home when he and Mike saw the island from the raft) I also wonder if she said those words to her mom.


Unsubtitled Translations

Jin said Sawyer and Sayid's names really clearly, before he finished his thoughts in Korean.


Flashback Cast

Ana Lucia's mom is her Captain.

Her partners name is Raggs.

The dude talking to the Captain mentions getting her the "IR's" ANYONE KNOW
WHAT THAT MEANT???

Her shrink/psychiatrists name was ???

Her ex-boyfriends name was Danny. Probably the father of the baby that Jason killed by shooting her.

The criminal (burglar) who shot her was named Jason McCormick. He lied to her and said it was a mistake, that he was a student. She allowed him to reach for the gun. They had a parital fingerprint of him and he confessed, but Ana let him go so she could get the only justice she felt was warranted??

Employment history - Ana is LAPD street cop

Songs of Lost - the song playing while Ana is in the bar waiting for Jason to leave???
Religious References

Suspicious Pen Sightings - Ana has 2 pens in her uniform pocket (not really suspicious, but it was a pen)

Parallel Plots & Recurring Themes
--> Broken Families - Ana's shrink asks about Danny and Ana says that he left. My gut says it's because they couldn't help each other through the loss of a child. Ana says she's the type that is better of alone. (she probably is trying to convince herself of that, due to the loss of a baby and she's unable to face the pain)


--> Recurring Phrases - Jack tells Kate that she hooked the golf ball (let you off the hook lines)

Jack tells Kate to hold Sawyer up while he gives him the medicine. (lift it up)

--> Other - Ana mentioned the couple with the crying baby have moved and she finds it too quiet now. On her first day back on the job the crying baby gets to her and she loses her cool, pulls her gun and tells the mother to take her baby upstairs.She asks Sayid if he has children, then we see the flashback where she shoots Jason and tells him that she was pregnant when he shot her.

Parking lots/Parkades keep coming up. Tom/Kate just before Tom died. Ana and Raggs returning to base and Raggs is pissed with her drawing her gun so fast. Ana murders Jason in a parking lot.

Jack says that Sawyer is 1/2 dead (glass 1/2 full kinda guy)


Numbers References
Ana mentioned her seat number 42F..........I missed the first few seconds.......did Jack say his number too???

At the firing range, Ana took 5 shots at the target and then 5 more???

Ana's shrink says they've been meeting for 4 months.

Ana's badge number was 68631

When the golf ball falls in the water trough it appeared to have writing/number on it. Anyone catch that???

Kate doubles her bet with Hurley over the golf shot, to increase it to $10,000.00??? So it was a $5,000.00 bet at first???

Charlie mentions Hurleys worth at $150 million???

Kate says the bet is for 3 holes, no handicap and the winner gets the bragging rights.

Ana and Raggs hear a call on the police radio re: domestic violence. It's not in their district, but Ana takes it anyways after hearing that it's only 3 blocks away. The address is 2210 Vederin. I also heard......Adam 16 This whole section I'm not too sure about

Jack mentions that at this club back home the women's tee is 10 feet closer to the hole.

When Ana asks Michael about how much they have back at camp, he says yes and I didn't catch how many boxes he said???

Jason shot Ana with 4 hollow point bullets that went through her Kevlar vest.

Locke asks Eko about the 5 of them. Eko corrects him and says there are 4 of them. (tailenders)

Jack says that Sawyer is 1/2 dead (glass 1/2 full kinda guy)

Sayid tells Ana that almost 40 days ago he tied a man to a tree and tortured him.

Ana tells Sayid that when they went to the burglary call, she went to the front door, her partner to the back. She mentions being there 1 minute before Jason appeared.
Ana asked him to show her ID and let him reach for it thinking he was a student.
When Ana shoots Jason I heard 3 shots, then 3 more???



Games - Jack and Kate play golf. Hurley and Kate have a golf shooting contest??

Locke is doing a crossword puzzle while on button duty.


Accidents - Ana accidently shot Shannon.

Drugs - Raggs asks Ana about her shrink giving her good drugs.

Weapons - Jack uses the golf club like a weapon when Eko approaches him. Ana takes Sayids gun, but throws it and her big knife down at his feet when she releases him.

Fights - Eko stops Sayid from attacking/shooting Ana. It appears that Sayid is winning until ??? bonks Sayid on the head.

Bondage / Captivity - Ana ties Sayid to the tree.

Sickness/Injury - Jack says that Sawyer is septic. The infection has gotten into his bloodstream

Bondage / Captivity

Sayid is tied up by (presumably) Libby, under Ana's direction, after Bernard refuses to do it. Interestingly, he's later set free by Ana herself, after a heart-to-heart about how (in my interpretation anyway) they're held captive by their pasts...like most of the islanders.

Sickness/Injury

Sawyer's gone septic by the time he gets back to the hatch...apparently he has a high fever and Jack seems worried...though he may be more worried about how Kate's cuddling Sawyer....

As far as injury goes, Ana does shoot the person who shot her. Bang. Dead.

Hey Moriane. Nice to see a new face. I'd sure appreciate more help. I want to go read other stuff so badly, but feel I should get this posted first. There were a lot of things I wasn't sure about, and would appreciate the input.



Incredible episode...hard to think of anything that could have been done better. I'm impressed almost beyond words...muchos kudos to all involved!!!

Yep, lots of potential clues to look at:

books behind Ana in shrink's office
"WW II" in clue on Locke's crossword puzzle (there's more to find on that one)
blue candle in hatch bunker where Sawyer was placed

"Echo Park" mentioned in LA flashback (a nod to Eko? clue to Island mysteries?)

We saw a closeup of Bernard's ring-less left hand but didn't get to see Rose give his ring back...I'm sure we will though.

Did anyone recognize anyone in the flashbacks as people we've already seen?

ETA Sorry for not including the outline headings...I'll try harder next time.

Reunions:
Jin/Sun
Michael/Vincent
Bernard/Rose
Jin-Michael-Sawyer/Losties

Morgue: Shannon:crybaby: (poor Sayid)

Don't worry about the headings. It's nice but not necessary. I missed the WWll in the crossword, but know there will be all kinds of interesting words to check out. (I hope) I missed the candle too. I can't believe I missed the Echo park reference. Doesn't even ring a bell. I watched the background people, but noone stood out to me.

Numbers:

Anna's response to domestic call, 8 Adam 15

Awesome. I didn't hear the first part. How about the very beginning when Ana and Jack are in the bar. Do we just hear Ana's seat number and not Jacks? I missed the first few seconds.


did anyone else catch that when the captain (anna's mom) and anna were looking at the guy through the one way glass at the police station, the captain told anna he was picked up in "ecko park"

Thanks. Like I said I totally missed that.

Sounds like Matt Raggs, Writer's Assistant, loaned out his name to Ana's partner!!

I'm really impressed with everyone's attention to detail.
Do you think that Ana was in Australia chasing down Kate? Didn't she meet up with that guy from her past in LA -- and there was a shoot out with cops.

Wait, I'm sorry. I did that wrong. I'm supposed to list observations. Ana was a cop in LA. Kate's friend was killed in LA.

Wait, I'm sorry. I did that wrong. I'm supposed to list observations. Ana was a cop in LA. Kate's friend was killed in LA.

:biggrin: No worries. It's supposed to be fun

Numbers References
captains office number - 315
her car was whatever unit 8 Adam 16
something something report 9 and another 9
when they got in the garage a very visible parking spot 6
Gilgamesh is #42 down on the crossword Locke is working on

Arcadia
Anyway, here are the two paralells I find most interesting right now.

1) Jack/Ana Lucia

They have the same role in their respective groups (which have been set against each other in a binary from "Adrift" on): They are the leaders. They both have parental issues. Jack was forced to defy his father/superior at work, but it was arguably for the best. Ana Lucia pressured her mother/superior, but it, seemingly wasn't for the best. Both have issues with pregnancy. Jack wasn't going to turn his dad in until he found out that the dead patient was pregnant. Ana Lucia was pregnant when she was shot, and it motived her to kill. Jack is the leader because he is a doctor; he has the ability to heal. Ana Lucia is an officer; though her job is meant to be one of a protector, she is trained to capture, even to kill. What a binary they are. What do you guys think about this?

On another note, I love the look Jack gave Ana Lucia at the end. He seemed shocked by her, horrified, disgusted, and yet he seemed to pity her too. It was powerful. She just looked lost. I liked his reaction to Shannon's death, how he was ready to grab the guns and get revenge, until he found out they were talking about her... that just changed everything. I thought it was great.

2. Locke/Eko. Another poweful binary. Both are the men of faith. Both are responsible for death but in different ways. Locke led Boone to his death, an innocent whom we mourn. Eko killed the Others, whom we are weary of, and we knew she should hate them. In stressful situations, both keep a clear head, but we get the sense that Locke (though I love him for it) isn't always thinking straight, that over time he has stopped putting the wellfare of the group first. Eko risked his life to help a man he didn't know. Locke became a man of communication, communicating with the island, guilding everyone (Claire and her baby, Sawyer and his boar, etc), while Eko was silent fro 40 days. Locke and Eko have the same role, but Eko seems to be good always, while Locke we are supposed to be watchful of, I think... of should we be? I won't say anymore about his binary, but wow, its powerful.

And they there is the tail section v. front section, which seems to be the declension of civilization v. the building of society...

Diaz
Jack and Ana-Lucia. A doctor and a cop. Overall the two most arrogant professions out there. Both think they are God. One has the power to save lives, the other has power to take it. These two are very transparent in this repsect.

Regarding Eko and Locke that is still left to be seen. Locke's 'faith' is not based on religion but more on fate and destiny whereas Eko so far seems to be more spiritual in his 'faith.'

So far, one seems to think his faith must be exercised for weal or woe (Locke) whereas the other's faith is predicated on non-violent, non-confrontational solutions if possible (Eko.) Locke seems to react to challenges to his faith and Eko expresses his faith by default. Locke is on a journey, Eko has already arrived. Locke believes he has a destiny but doesn't have a clue as to what it is whereas somone like Eko already knows what their destiny is because they are fulfulling it every moment.

All assumption of course, especially regarding Eko since we know so little about him right now. and he is definitely willing to use violence to confront what he think is 'evil.'

Peach
When Ana-Lucia shot Jason, it REALLY reminded me of when Sawyer shot the Shrimp Man. Of course, Sawyer's victim was innocent, while Jason really was the one who'd harmed A-L in the past...still, their motivations at the time appeared identical in the way they both coldly fired their guns.

StickMang

I liked the juxtaposition of Jack questioning Eko, and Ana questioning Sayid, and the irony of each of the questionees turning the tables on the interrogators, especially when one is a master at interrogation himself! Brilliant juxtaposition.

-Mang

Arcadia Peach: I agree, the killing reminded me very much of Sawyer, and now that I think about it, that similarity raises yet another binary. Sawyer and Ana Lucia both killed a man out of revenge. Sawyer killed and old man who we he believed to have destroyed his past, and he was wrong. Ana Lucia killed a young man who destroyed her future, and until proven otherwise, I assume she had the right man. Very interesting. Also, Ana Lucia is certainly a better killer than Sawyer. It was repeated over and over again by various characters that Sawyer didn’t have it in him to kill, though he managed it anyway. He was a lot more hesitant. Ana Lucia was much fiercer, more brutal. I wonder what that means?

QueenElessar
Jack wasn't mad at Locke until he realized that Locke lied about factors surrounding Boone's death.

With Ana Lucia, it was an accident...a horrible one, but it wasn't really decietful. Plus Boone was really just the final straw in terms of Jack finally clashing with Locke. It was brewing for a long time, because of their different philosophys. Jack and Ana Lucia are actually more alike. Although they have different attitudes, they both naturally take charge...and they rush into situations as well.

I didn't think his reaction to seeing her was out of place. It really didn't have anything to do with him really KNOWING her as a person. It was about seeing a girl that he'd flirted with in an airport...a regular girl...before both their worlds changed forever in a plane crash disaster. And suddenly here that same girl was...having just killed someone in a horrible jungle accident. It's surreal and sobering, and I think it kind of makes people think about the how bizarre their lives have become.

Shannon had abandonment issues as well as Ana

Jack said everyone wants him to lead until they don't like the decisions he makes.

Ana had some tough decisions to make that kept the tailies alive, and they questioned her motives and left her.

Crossword puzzle - http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v683/Griz20/ScreenShot011.jpg


Enkidu's friend = Gilgamesh.

Gods created Enkidu as a counterpoint to Gilgamesh, to make him "whole."

diabolo237 There once was a fellow named Gilgamesh. Gilgamesh was a phenomenal individual. He was one third man and two thirds god. Due to his special abilities, Gilgamesh felt he was worthy of everyone's praise, and therefore bossed everyone around. The citizens of Uruk were displeased with Gilgamesh's behavior and asked the gods for help. The gods responded by sending a man named Enkidu, who was a double of Gilgamesh. Enkidu lived in the forest with all the animals, and was a wild savage. One day Gilgamesh sent a hunter and a beautiful woman to the forest, planning to distract Enkidu from the animals. The hunter left, and Enkidu and the woman became good friends. Enkidu was turned into a man, and he left with the woman for Uruk.

When Enkidu entered the city, the citizens praised him as if he were king. Gilgamesh heard of Enkidu's entrance, and soon became jealous. When the two men encountered one another, they immediately began to fight. As the fight ended, each stood up, and each saw them self in the other's eyes. They embraced and immediately became friends. The two men got to know each other, and then decided to go on a quest seeking fame.


http://www.ac.wwu.edu/~dtmason/enkandgil.htm


Griz Gilgamesh seems to be the correct answer for the clue but the other words involved are a little suspect: ACOLNS - GHARE - SIEND - IMGTATIVE. Whoever was working the puzzle before seems to have screwed up. I say somone else was working the puzzle because of the difference in the I's - I & i. The depths I have sunk to when I am a critic of a 2 second shot of someone working a crossword puzzle. But, are there any other puzzles left in the episode for us to solve?
Also of note, the Epic of Gilgamesh is not a complete story, as quite a bit of it has been lost over the years. What we know has been pieced together, but we don't know the whole story.
Thanks! I think the answers are all right, Ghent means The (treaty of Ghent) and then the other answers probably go with some special type of clue.
Gilgamesh is the lead character in "The Epic of Gilgamesh," an epic poem, the oldest written work in the world. Only partially reconstructed. Deals with Sumerian mythology.

Enkidu is Gilgamesh's best friend (or lover, depending on who you ask), created by the gods to counteract/complete him.


This totally sounds like Jack and Ana Lucia to me. Jack- the "ideal" leader and Ana the wild leader will balance each other out after some fighting.

Jack=Gilgamesh, Ana=Enkidu?

Arad I found AL's "revenge" scene very much like none other than our good pal, Sawyer's revenge. Both eased their heads with some drinks (AL sure does love to knock em' back, haha, awesome) before very astutely and with resolve, killed who they needed to kill for revenge. Of course, we all know how that turned out in Sawyer's case....


LockeHurleySawyer Maybe she was talking to Danny on the cell phone? Her ex?

WIF:
In target practice Ana shoots 5 then 6=11 shots
When Ana first comes back she passes several Mug shots the 1st one I think is Kate's (need to rewatch)
The license plate on their patrol car (Have to watch again to catch but it is visable.)

Things that were said that I thought were revelant: Eko "Are you looking for Peace, Revenge or Justice. (Goes along with our list of 3's)

In the Hatch (hope I can find a screen cap) when Eko is talking to Jack trying to convince him not to go after A-L up on a back shelf there looks like there's a cross. It's probably shadows but it follows that there is a cross on Jason's t-shirt when A-L shoots him.

Note that A-L said that Jason was never found. Don't think Goodwin was ever found either.

WIF:

Things that were said that I thought were revelant: Eko "Are you looking for Peace, Revenge or Justice. (Goes along with our list of 3's).

I totally thought of you when I saw that scene. Are you keeping track of these sightings. I can't keep up with all of it, and the list of 3's really interests me. I know I've said I'd go find the ones I've referred to, but I haven't. I have great intentions, but I get side-tracked way too easily.

numbersarefun Pretty neat with the crossword puzzle. This explained alot.

The story of Gilgamesh is that Gilgamesh was a god-like king who wielded too much power. The people complained and asked the gods to send help. They delivered and "equal" god named Enkido.

So Locke is Gilgamesh and Eko is Enkido.

Music805 I grew up near Echo Park in L.A. That's about as oppisite of Westwood you can get (which was where AL went to on her first day back).


This could go under Goofs

spookyb18 Just as a side note, because this is bugging me, but why on earth would Sun be on the beach doing laundry after the whole drama she's just witnessed? She just found out Jin is alive, she SOOOO would not be back at the beach doing laundry, she'd be running through the jungle like a mad woman looking for her man. I mean, come on, after that whole ring ordeal? Just a little screw up from the eppy that is annoying me.

In the Canadian preview
...


Can anyone tell me WHY Canada has different previews than we do? (we=U.S.) Do other countries have different previews, too?

Sorry to go a bit OT, but I find it curious.

Will continue reading this thread with great interest! I'm sorry I didn't find it sooner.

Can anyone tell me WHY Canada has different previews than we do? (we=U.S.) Do other countries have different previews, too?

Sorry to go a bit OT, but I find it curious.

Will continue reading this thread with great interest! I'm sorry I didn't find it sooner.Yes, it seems other countries have different promos. We saw the way the UK promoted the first season and it was made especially for them. It is knowing how to market to your audience.

Thank you, Sam G.

What did Charlie and Hurley call Kate? (something like bionic or steroids??)


Is that a 5 on the little target man?
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=4

Anyone recognize the design on Ana's t-shirt?
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=9
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=10

Books on shelf in psychiatrists office
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=11

Ana's badge
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=15

Police station - Division One
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=51
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=52

Raggs is wearing a wedding ring
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=148

What's pik on creepy guys t-shirt
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=149
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=152

Raggs badge
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=154
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=272 Note: pen in his pocket too
Crossword questions
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=224
Answers
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=225

Parking level 6 in the police garage and license plate # 5Q49987
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=271

Jason McCormick's t-shirt
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=275
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=282

Books on shelf in Hatch
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=290
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=291

Books on Desmond's bed shelf and blue candle
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=303
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=307

Books and mural
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=365
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=366
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=367

Books
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=369

Pik behind Eko, kitchen stuff and what's above Kate?
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=398

Ana's animal print shirt
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=438
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=439
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=446

Jason's shirt
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=440
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=444
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=447
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=449 Note: 1969
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=453

Calendar in the bar
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=442

Ana guzzling and a turtle on the wall
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=443

Thomas Hobbes The song was "Outside" by Staind. I believe it was released in 1999 or 2000.

I think the lyrics - "Inside you're ugly/ugly like me" are appropriate.

Lyrics
http://www.lyricsexpert.com/staind/staind-lyrics08.html

Ana's ring
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=414

Gilgamesh was in one of my favorite Star Trek Next Generations. "Darmok"

PICARD
(continuing)
There is a story... A very ancient
one. From Earth. I'll try to
remember...

He attempts to match the Tamarian's "story-telling"
voice.

PICARD
Gilgamesh. Was a king. At Uruk.
He tormented his subjects. He
drove them to anger. They cried
out -- "Give our king a companion.
Spare us his madness."

Picard glances at the Tamarian -- the alien's eyes are
glazed, but rapt.

PICARD
(continuing)
Enkidu. A wildman. Of the
forest. Entered the city. They
fought in the temple. They fought
in the street. Gilgamesh defeated
Enkidu. They became friends.
(beat)
Gilgamesh and Enkidu. At Uruk.

The alien's voice is extremely weak. As if he's just
repeating Picard's words unconsciously.

DATHON
(weak; mimicking)
At Uruk...

Picard can see that Dathon is failing. Picard's voice
becomes almost a whisper, softly making the transition
to his own way of speaking.

PICARD
(quiet)
The new friends went into the
desert, where the Great Bull of
Heaven was killing men by the
hundreds. Enkidu caught it by
the tail, Gilgamesh struck it with
his sword.

DATHON
(barely audible,
mimicking)
Gilgamesh...

PICARD
They were victorious. But Enkidu
fell to the ground. Struck down
by the gods...

The alien closes his eyes... Picard looks at him. The
Tamarian shudders once -- and is completely still.

PICARD
(continuing; a whisper)
And Gilgamesh wept bitter tears,
saying, "He who was my companion
through adventure and hardships,
is gone forever... "

Hi guys! I'm here....Finally trying to recover from such an awesome episode! I'm off to scroll!

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=398 This is the cross I am talking about see the Red bowl on the shelf above Kate there are 2 shadows that make a cross.

There is the cross on Jason's shirt when A-L shoots him http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=449

answering WIF:
>>> golf ball...looks like a circle drawn in black on it, to mark it as one's ball
>>> but it made me think of the glass eye in the Arrow hatch

Jack throws Sawyer into the shower to reduce his fever. He tells Kate to go get the Effloxocin?? (little white pills), alcohol, ........??
>>> gauze pads
>>>************ETA and strip the bed and put clean sheets on it

She asks Mike if they have ammo back at their camp. She tells him to get her a big pack, jeans, socks................????
and she will let his friend go when he returns with all that.
>>> at least half the ammo
>>> clothes, jeans, socks
>>> food
>>> blankets

Ana and her mother speak spanish to each other when the topic gets personal.
>>> her mother only spoke in English...also maybe Ana reverted back to child-role/childhood of being raised
>>> speaking Spanish, but her mother stayed in the present or to keep distance..there is definitely
>>> tension in their relationship
>>>************ETA maybe her mother is concerned about Ana's well-being coming
>>> back to work, especially on patrol, after being shot by 4 hollow
>>> point bullets

Ana asks for a transfer so her mom caves and gives her a car??? When Ana asks her mom why she is doing this (cuz she's her mom or boss) her mom replies, "both"
>>> mean she is being put back on patrol

When Ana and Raggs return to the police station, there is a big Caution sign (Raggs disposition?/opposite of Ana's) He uses the nickname "A O" and uses the term, "draw down"
>>> I heard "A-L" (he calls her that like some of us do)

Libby tells Ana that she can't live out here all alone, which Ana replies, "I'm already alone" (reference to losing Danny, job and baby??)
>>> and her leadership role/style of the Tailies, alienated from her team due to style/decisions made

Ana has a scratch on her cheek like Jack did???
>>> from when Eko hit her/Eko threw her into the pit with the Losties

Jack insinuates that because he's a doctor, that he's a good golfer. "Golf is accuracy"
>>>************ETA Kate said tips, not advice
>>> Kate said "you're giving me tips?", Jack said "I'm a doctor"...I took that to mean "that's what doctors do" ETA (give advice)

Ana tells Libby that she won't let Sayid go because she killed someone he loved???
How does she know, we just found out. Sayid didn't even probably know till he said it???
>>> she possibly made that assumption since Sayid was on his knees, cradling Shannon closely,
>>> and from the look of anguish on his face

What did Jack and Kate use to decide who went first at golf? It was red, but I didn't catch it.
>>> red golf tee

>>>************ETA made corrections

more of answering WIF:
Parallel Plots & Recurring Themes
--> Broken Families
>>> the couple in the domestic call that Ana and her partner responded to
>>>************ETA and their baby

Numbers References
Ana mentioned her seat number 42F..........I missed the first few seconds.......did Jack say his number too???
>>> no, Jack repeated "42F" back to her
>>>************ETA actually Jack said his seat #, 42F, and Ana repeated "42F" back
>>> to him

At the firing range, Ana took 5 shots at the target and then 5 more???
>>> yep

Kate doubles her bet with Hurley over the golf shot, to increase it to $10,000.00??? So it was a $5,000.00 bet at first???
>>> think so

Charlie mentions Hurleys worth at $150 million???
>>> yep

Jason shot Ana with 4 hollow point bullets that went through her Kevlar vest.
>>> I just heard "vest" (no Kevlar)

Locke asks Eko about the 5 of them. Eko corrects him and says there are 4 of them. (tailenders)
>>> at first I thought he wasn't counting himself cause not on the plane (hehe) but I think he might
>>> be leaving Cindy out since she's missing

Ana asked him to show her ID and let him reach for it thinking he was a student.
>>> quote "I let him reach"

Fights - Eko stops Sayid from attacking/shooting Ana. It appears that Sayid is winning until ??? bonks Sayid on the head.
>>> I think it was Ana..she's good at that

>>>************ETA made corrections

Good stuff Tabby. Thanks!

ennui108 Tonight was the first time we saw Jack actually ask someone to push the button. I never started a thread about it, but back when everyone was complaining about that final scene in Orientation (saying it was contrived), I was thinking of the 'foot in the door' principal. 'Foot in the door' states that once you get a person to say yes to something once, it's much easier to get them to say yes again. That's why car salesmen offer free stuff "if you just take a test drive". Locke needed Jack to push the button in Orientation- now it has clearly paid off. Even if Jack is not a believer in the button, Locke has this little power over him now.

And once you get someone to say yes to something like a button- what else can you get them to say yes to?


SMoK9977 I don't think that Jack believes in the button. When Locke was looking to see what was going on, Jack didn't want to be bothered and the beeping was a simple way to get rid of him at that moment. I also found the way he said "John, the button" was kind of patronizing. Sort of the way I would humour my daugther who insists on doing something that I know she will out grow soon enough.


banshee I didn't find anything patronizing...They had 4 min left so someone had to push it. Kate was off getting supplies & Locke was distracted asking a bunch of questions about Sawyer. I didn't even think it was a case of trying to get rid of Locke, it was just being practical-it's beeping & somebody needs to handle it.

Jack can be reluctant to accept certain responsibilities at first, but when he commits himself it's absolutely. He's either in or out. He pushed it in Orientation & to him that was a promise so he's bound now. It's why he resisted in the first place, both for himself & because he knew it would enslave them all.


pacejunkie But we know from Rose that Jack recently completed a shift in the hatch. So I assume it means he's a regular button pusher now like everyone else until they figure something out.


Monsoon_Season I saw it as Jack's way-delayed comback to Locke's "with all due respect Jack, since when do I report to you."
If Jack was truely concerned about the countdown, he would have asked with urgency for Locke to push the button and then help out Kate with getting supplies. Instead he was almost staking out his territory. As in, I'm saving someone's life now, you go do your 'all roads lead to this button which is our destiny' thing.
As a Jack fan, I found that exchange to be among season two's funniest moments so far.
and
We disagree on the meaning of Jack's comment to Locke, but I think you are right that he sees the importance in pushing the button and that the end of Orientation was a big step for him.
But for now the button is just something he would rather let others take care of. Something more comfortable for him to dismiss as important to others rather than accept as important for himself. Kind of like the memorial service when they burned the fuselage. He reluctantly saw how much it meant to everyone else, but still didn't feel comfortable taking part. The button represents a lot of faith-issues he's still struggling with, and we're learning bit by bit why (I expect the fate of his marriage will explain a lot).



ennui108 Jack didn't need a comeback- he already had a great one, "With all due respect, John- but you lied." Why does everyone forget that part? It was great!

Kate had to be yelled at by Jack to go get alcohol from Sawyer, when Boone was injured/ Jack had to repeat his order to Kate to go get the penicllin for Sawyer.

czardingus since AL said she USED to be a cop, perhaps she was in Australia to catch Kate and collect the 23 grand. AL would make a very biyotchin' bounty hunter...



ennui108 Tonight was the first time we saw Jack actually ask someone to push the button. I never started a thread about it, but back when everyone was complaining about that final scene in Orientation (saying it was contrived), I was thinking of the 'foot in the door' principal. 'Foot in the door' states that once you get a person to say yes to something once, it's much easier to get them to say yes again. That's why car salesmen offer free stuff "if you just take a test drive". Locke needed Jack to push the button in Orientation- now it has clearly paid off. Even if Jack is not a believer in the button, Locke has this little power over him now.

And once you get someone to say yes to something like a button- what else can you get them to say yes to?


SMoK9977 I don't think that Jack believes in the button. When Locke was looking to see what was going on, Jack didn't want to be bothered and the beeping was a simple way to get rid of him at that moment. I also found the way he said "John, the button" was kind of patronizing. Sort of the way I would humour my daugther who insists on doing something that I know she will out grow soon enough.

Danni My husband thought it was interesting how Desmond took care of the button pushing all those years and now we have a whole clan of people, on shifts, and it gets forgotten, almost. Too much distraction.


banshee I didn't find anything patronizing...They had 4 min left so someone had to push it. Kate was off getting supplies & Locke was distracted asking a bunch of questions about Sawyer. I didn't even think it was a case of trying to get rid of Locke, it was just being practical-it's beeping & somebody needs to handle it.

Jack can be reluctant to accept certain responsibilities at first, but when he commits himself it's absolutely. He's either in or out. He pushed it in Orientation & to him that was a promise so he's bound now. It's why he resisted in the first place, both for himself & because he knew it would enslave them all.


pacejunkie But we know from Rose that Jack recently completed a shift in the hatch. So I assume it means he's a regular button pusher now like everyone else until they figure something out.

Monsoon_Season I saw it as Jack's way-delayed comback to Locke's "with all due respect Jack, since when do I report to you."
If Jack was truely concerned about the countdown, he would have asked with urgency for Locke to push the button and then help out Kate with getting supplies. Instead he was almost staking out his territory. As in, I'm saving someone's life now, you go do your 'all roads lead to this button which is our destiny' thing.
As a Jack fan, I found that exchange to be among season two's funniest moments so far.
and
We disagree on the meaning of Jack's comment to Locke, but I think you are right that he sees the importance in pushing the button and that the end of Orientation was a big step for him.
But for now the button is just something he would rather let others take care of. Something more comfortable for him to dismiss as important to others rather than accept as important for himself. Kind of like the memorial service when they burned the fuselage. He reluctantly saw how much it meant to everyone else, but still didn't feel comfortable taking part. The button represents a lot of faith-issues he's still struggling with, and we're learning bit by bit why (I expect the fate of his marriage will explain a lot).


ennui108 Jack didn't need a comeback- he already had a great one, "With all due respect, John- but you lied." Why does everyone forget that part? It was great!




Locke and Eko's exchange (Hello)

foggynotion It really reminded me of men of different clothes exchanging knowing nods and hellos. Like a buddhist monk and a rabbi recognizing the "divine spark" (for lack of a less polarzing word) in eachother. They saw an understanding and a simple silent wisdom in one another.


Goof? or clue?

penyours One other thing I'm wondering is when Ana lucia talks to Jack in the airport bar, isn't she wearing a dress? But then when they come out of the water, she's in full rambina gear. Why would she change into rabina gear just to be on an airplane?


elfdream Someone wondered if perhaps she hadn't gone into private work and Jack's MOTHER had hired her to make sure Jack came home or to keep tabs on him...something I thought was interesting.

She seemed almost happy and well adjusted in the airport scene..flirting and talking with Jack. I wonder if perhaps she didn't go on a 'walkabout' or something. Did she have some quality 'down' time in Australia? She just didn't seem like the tortured soul who had lost a baby and killed someone in cold blood.

Originally Posted by elfdream

Except for the drinking so early in the morning thing. She passed that off as a fear of flying...was it really? Drinking problem perhaps? Drying out suddenly in the jungle perhaps? Just an idea.



belshep Interesting idea...a sudden, involuntary, cold turkey detox could explain a lot of her behavior in the first 48 days on the island and the contrast with the airport scene.

It would also provide a contrast with Charlie, who made a conscious decision to quit his addiction and had the support of Locke and Jack at the time.

Kate had to be yelled at by Jack to go get alcohol from Sawyer, when Boone was injured/ Jack had to repeat his order to Kate to go get the penicllin for Sawyer.


czardingus since AL said she USED to be a cop, perhaps she was in Australia to catch Kate and collect the 23 grand. AL would make a very biyotchin' bounty hunter...

Danni My husband thought it was interesting how Desmond took care of the button pushing all those years and now we have a whole clan of people, on shifts, and it gets forgotten, almost. Too much distraction.

Lost Links
http://www.lostlinks.net/

Link of the day re: Desmond

When Desmond met Jack Shephard for the first time, he was wearing a shirt that had an unknown emblem on the front, left breast pocket area (see photo at left). The meaning behind this emblem has yet to be discovered.
FACTS: The Scottish Freemasons' crest is that of a two-headed falcon, which resembles the bird in this emblem.
Desmond is Scottish.
The Washington DC project to rebuild the Pentagon, after the 9-11 terrorist attack, is called "The Firebird Pentagon Project." The two-headed bird on the emblem resembles a Firebird.
SPECULATION: The pentagon around the 2 headed bird appears to be hand-drawn.
Desmond may belong to a secret sect of the Scottish Freemasons.
Desmond may work for the US Government and been connected to "The Firebird Pentagon Project."
Since the Firebird is a symbol of rebirth, Desmond may be connected to some organization that is working on reanimation or cloning.

Locke and Eko's exchange (Hello)

foggynotion It really reminded me of men of different clothes exchanging knowing nods and hellos. Like a buddhist monk and a rabbi recognizing the "divine spark" (for lack of a less polarzing word) in eachother. They saw an understanding and a simple silent wisdom in one another.


car88win Find it ironic - if not alreay stated - both Ana and Kate had a Jason in their lives. A no good Jason at that.

Huh? I don't remember Jason in Kates past. More info please.

sledgeweb Try replacing GILGAMESH with SCRIPTURE and see what you get.

Books on Desmond's Shelf
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?na... m=820&pos=307

One of them is:
http://portal.brint.com/cgi-bin/amazon.cgi?item_id=0941831957&search_type=AsinSearch&locale=us

"Hindsights: The Wisdom and Breakthroughs of Remarkable People
Customer Reviews:
Rating: 2
Summary: Bland and unremarkable

Comment: I'm a big fan of Kawasaki. Hindsights is, however, a disappointment. The stories are bland. The insights are cliché - Never give up. Be Honest. Believe in your dream.

Each chapter is about a different person and their wisdom and breakthroughs. However, the chapters are too short and too superficial to draw you in and make you care about the person, which makes their revelations seem unremarkable. It's a great idea for a book, but it's poorly executed in this offering."

Interesting since Lost has an episode about each character and their wisdoms and breakthroughs.

SAM G

Picard and Dathan at El-Adrel
This is totally what I was thinking when I saw the Gilgamesh corssword reference. That was one of the best ST-TNG episodes.

So what's this?
Locke and Eko at Hanso Island
the security system, shaka when the walls fell
Locke and Eko on the ocean

or something like that

Maggie thanks for figuring out one of the books. Your thoughts on it are spot on. I love these easter eggs they plant for us.

Earlier I posted this

Goof? or clue?
penyours One other thing I'm wondering is when Ana lucia talks to Jack in the airport bar, isn't she wearing a dress? But then when they come out of the water, she's in full rambina gear. Why would she change into rabina gear just to be on an airplane?


but it's WRONG

AL wasn't wearing a dress. She was wearing a brown leather jacket, a white shirt, and jeans, which I'm pretty sure is what she's wearing when she washes up on the beach. I think that one's a case of someone's overactive imagination.

Sorry, WIF, I had to make corrections to 2 of my long posts on page 3...they're
marked like this:
>>>************ETA

Also noticed that TV guy (Shawna's BF/hubby) was wearing a necklace (maybe silver)...

Screencap of partial bullet pattern on Ana's target practice (she fired a few more
shots to the chest after this, making a "Y" pattern)...she's pretty accurate:
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=4

Jason's T-Shirt when he gets shot down looks to be a cross in a shield, with IV 69 or LV 69 on it..

Doesn't mean anything to me.. ?

Jason's T-shirt in the police station looks to be a Saggitarius creature.

http://images.google.com/images?svnum=10&q=sagittarius&btnG=Search

Looks like 19 - 69 on the shirt but again like Desmon's polo the artwork is a mystery.

Shannon's crossword book in the airport

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=469&pos=676 (http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=469&pos=676)



re: The crossword puzzle

TRoss Possible meanings for asids, WW2 movie (hyph. word), pagr, and Iona (Macbeth place) . . .


Unless the rest of the words are unimportant and made-up, the word at the bottom of 42 down HAS to be "aSids". I thought at first this was a Canadian, English, or other non-American spelling of the word "acids", but I found only one reference to that online:
asids (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:wdxknljvJwgJ:www.nioch.nsc.ru/mirrors/press/chemwood/volume1/n2/stat2.en.html+asids&hl=en&ie=UTF-8)


WHOA!! What's this? ASIDS (http://www.goodshare.org/asids.htm) (underlining done by me)

ASIDS in collaborative structures

(acute systems-inquiry deficiency syndrome)

january 19th, 1998
"this note reflects on how individuals in collaborative situations (teams, organizations, relationships), as a result of deficient system inquiry practices, expose themselves to pathologies which erode their perceptual capabilities. there is a strong analogy here between today's systems' inquiry/management practice and pre-pasteur medical practice; the latter being guided by the theory of in-situ 'spontaneous generation' of infection rather than bacterial 'network' and the former being guided by 'euclidian' closed system theories rather than by non-euclidian 'evolutionary flow'.


incomplete understanding of complex systems and the evolutionary consequences of our interactions with such systems can give rise to pathologies which erode our pattern recognition abilities. the ability to recognize patterns characterizing complex system behaviors is vital to our management or 'steering' of these systems. incompleteness in understanding systems behaviors also leads to the development of problem-solving approaches which exacerbate rather than relieve the pathologies --- a vicious cycle."



This is a bit above my head, but it seems to be some kind of syndrome that may affect groups like ours, leading to a "vicious cycle"? As in some of the problems they face? Or perhaps something everyone on the island is facing?


~ ~ ~

Also found a possible contender for #40 down, a hyphenated word - the name of a World War II movie - the only one I found was Catch-22 (http://us.imdb.com/title/tt0065528/). Here's a brief synopsis:
"A bombardier in World War II tries desperately to escape the insanity of the war. However, sometimes insanity is the only sane way cope with a crazy situation. Catch-22 is a parody of a "military mentality" and of a bureaucratic society in general."
While it makes a statement about society, don't know that it's related to the society in LOST - they're not exactly military, NOR bureaucratic.

~ ~ ~

And if there IS an #84 across, it would be "paghr", which turns out to be the Klingon pronounciation of the number zero!!
Paghr (http://66.102.7.104/search?q=cache:fS86W7dmDg8J:members.aol.com/jpklingon/allyouneed.html+paghr&hl=en&ie=UTF-8)
~ ~ ~

Iona, #36 down, was the "Macbeth place" as listed in the crossword puzzle. Iona appears to be an island, though I don't know if that in itself is significant to the play. What is of interest are the recurring motifs in Macbeth:

Wikipedia: Macbeth (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Macbeth) Ambition, betrayal, children, chaos & indecision, conflict & opposition . . . common themes in many dramas - but do any of these relate directly to LOST?


Ana and Sayids talk re:her history . . . . parallels Eko and Lockes brief encounter. Words weren't needed to communicate?


Danielle's map and Mr. Paiks screen with the island?

http://img179.imageshack.us/my.php?image=theislandmrpaik0wv.jpg


EllsBells1960
Maybe 'TV guy' & 'Husband' are twins!!!



Jason's t-shirt

http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=449


Archangel 1969....Apollo moon landing.....Apollo bars....


happypixie hmm it is interesting it looks like a swiss rescue team shirt I could be wrong. Hmmm the building that is on the oriantation film is right on the boarder of the swiss line. Sorry it may not be anything but I thought is would be worth mentioning.

Stigmata and the 3 cut wounds on peeps faces is making a comeback.

Dang girl.....you've been busy! I've gotten the other 48 days done on the LLL so far. Awesome gathering.

hubby
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=115&pos=718
http://lost-media.com/modules/coppermine/albums/ep-caps/season1/1x11-cowboys/daddy-issues0722.jpg

Lady that Dr. Christian Shephard killed, while operating intoxicated
http://lost-media.com/modules/coppermine/albums/ep-caps/season1/1x11-cowboys/daddy-issues0085.jpg
Mother with baby and angry TV guy (is this lady on table and dude in hallway with Dr. Shephard?)
http://lost-media.com/modules/coppermine/albums/ep-caps/season2/2x08-collision/2/collision-cap150.jpg

Arguing TV guy is the father of the pregnant woman that Christian killed????
http://lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=149

car88win Matt Moore (Travis) - Collision

Matt Moore (Husband) - All The Best Cowboys

according to tv tome yes, same guy
AND
No that's the picture of the guys wife, what you want is when Christian consoles him in the hallway and Jack talks to the nurse asking her who is the guy that his dad is talking to

They're saying it's the same guy not the same girl
I'm thinking it's her on the table, am I understanding that you don't car?

I guess, I was under the impression they were confused if it was the same guy. I wasn't aware about the girlfriend/wife comparison. If it is, I can't find any actor info to back it up yet.

Now that we know that A-L was shot, did Christian or Jack work on her? If Jack worked on her, they must have never talked to each other. Maybe she was worked on in the ER and then transferred.

I guess, I was under the impression they were confused if it was the same guy. I wasn't aware about the girlfriend/wife comparison. If it is, I can't find any actor info to back it up yet.

Too true. I forgot to put my analytical hat on for that one. (still had my theory hat on) :biggrin:

No problem. I kind of almost got wrapped up in it myself. It's hard to keep the "fan" seperate from the work. The fan creeps out now and then :rolleyes:

Just listened to the podcast commentary.
Ana's partner's name was Big Mike played by Michael Cudlitz.

Mark Gilbert played Detective Raggs (guy in a suit that comes to get AL for her cake and when they catch Jason) the character's name was meant as a shout out to Matt Raggs writer's asst.

Shawna is the name of the woman with the screaming baby.

The Jason in Kate's past was the guy that was holding up the bank in NM with her. Not the same actor, not the same Jason.

Rachel Ticotin played AL's mom. When they said in the podcast she had been in Total Recall I finally placed her, she wasn't listed on the press release. http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001797/

Ana-Lucia is wearing her ring in the flashbacks, you can clearly see it in the scene in the therapist's office. (She pretty much tells the therapist and her partner that Danny has gone and its for the best. So why still wearing the ring, even now? Perhaps he isn't the one that gave it to her?)

Hey Ducky! Thanks for the update. I haven't listened to the podcast yet. I was going to cue that up tonight when I rewatched. :kiss:

I liked the podcast a lot, its great not to have to wait for the DVD for the commentary. There were a couple of film/literature references they made in the scenes with Ana-Lucia and Sayid near the end that I didn't quite catch. Maybe you can pick up on them. I hit some dead spots in it where the audio cut out for seconds at time, don't know if anyone else had that problem. (not the normal pauses they did for commercial breaks)

Liscense plate on AL/Big Mike's Squadcar = 5Q49987
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=271

Cool, thanks. I'll see if I can pick that up.

Bondage/Captivity:
Jason McCormick is cuffed on the wrists and placed in an interrogation room by the LAPD.
Presumably they released him after AL denied he was her attacker.
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=275

Jack pulled a pair of scissors out of the yellow mug. Oxyfloxacin (an antibiotic) little white pills.

Hello. Don't want to hijack your thread so I'll be brief:

I have been loosly following these LLL threads for some time now and was just wondering if the website is up yet?

Also, wanted to offer my character connections page. I havnt touched it in awhile but you may find it usefull. Feel free to make any changes.
http://n.1asphost.com/psyweb/

OK... Carry on...:biggrin:

That's ok Psyweb. It's still an ongoing site. There's some question as to when it will be public. I am sure that something will be worked out by January. It's not that the site is bust - by no means. I've just finished working on 48 Days. It's more of a technical issue. I would check the main LLL thread which you can find in my sig, or Creme, Cinamin, Waltisfuture or TRoss. This will be the place that we will announce any developments with the site. Thank you for your interest!

Love your connections. With your permission, it would be a nice addition to that entry. You would of course get credit. If your willing, I can add it.

Love your connections. With your permission, it would be a nice addition to that entry. You would of course get credit. If your willing, I can add it.

Sure. :)

That's great! If you have any other questions you can PM me anytime.


Ok, your added to the site. psyweb's connections (http://n.1asphost.com/psyweb/) is how it looks.

When I tried to watch with the podcast, I only got maybe half way I think and that was the end of the cast! It like stopped. And I know I downloaded it properly. All the others worked fine. Oh, well. Suckeroni

When I tried to watch with the podcast, I only got maybe half way I think and that was the end of the cast! It like stopped. And I know I downloaded it properly. All the others worked fine. Oh, well. Suckeroni


That's weird but you can still read the transcript here.
http://thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=27099

Ah, many thanks! I was wondering if I'd find out what else that had to say besides BIIIIIIIGGGG MIIIIIIKE! LOL

Hello. Don't want to hijack your thread so I'll be brief:

I have been loosly following these LLL threads for some time now and was just wondering if the website is up yet?

Also, wanted to offer my character connections page. I havnt touched it in awhile but you may find it usefull. Feel free to make any changes.
http://n.1asphost.com/psyweb/

OK... Carry on...:biggrin:

Please don't feel you can't post in these threads. The point is to have a place to gather observations to take back to the LLL. Interest in posting on these threads has slowed down IMO due to the fact that we're not up and running yet.

It's not "our" thread. It's supposed to be a place that any poster can post what they've noticed (that corresponds with the categories at the beginning of the list) I try and get as much as I can in my first post, but there's no way I get it all. Especially the character connections and philisophical stuff etc. I just take notes and fill in the blanks then go read all the other threads and bring the goodies I find back.

I usually have several questions in my first post that I really appreciate help in clearing them up. I also miss a lot of the literature and movie connections.

So anyways, to all that read this. Please feel free to participate. It's very much appreciated.

Hey, I got a bit of irony to post. Not sure if it fits into the list but still worth noting ...

From Pilot 2 regarding the Marshall ...

KATE: But you said yesterday that if you took it out --

JACK: I know, but that was yesterday. I was hoping he'd be at a hospital by
now. If I leave him like this, he'll be dead within a day. If I open him up --if
I can control the bleeding and if he doesn't go into sepsis and if I can find
some antibiotics -- he might be all right.

Way back in Tabula Rasa there was this dialogue in regards to Jack helping the Marshall ...

SAWYER: Let me ask you something. How many of those pills are you going to use
to fix him up?

JACK: As many as it takes.

Then in Whatever The Case May Be ...

JACK: Cephalexin.

SAWYER: Yeah? Go on.

JACK: That's the antibiotic I've been giving you for the knife wound in your
arm/shoulder. You're right in the middle of a treatment cycle now, if I keep giving you
the pills, you're gonna be as right as rain. But I'm gonna stop giving you the
pills. (Sawyer gets it.) And for two days you're gonna think you're all good.
Then it's gonna start to itch. The day after that, the fever's gonna come and
you're gonna start seeing red lines running up and down your arm. (Jack takes a
couple of steps toward Sawyer.) Day or two after that, you'll beg me to take
the case just to cut off your arm.

The irony comes into play because Sawyer is shot in his arm. The same arm that Sayid stabbed? Then Sawyer ends up septic and Jack has to save him using the pills in this episode. :)

Edit: Might be a bit of cosmic Karma that Sawyer was shot given that he failed to put the Marshall out of his misery (when he tried to shoot the Marshall in the heart and missed).

Traekos, That's my kind of linking. Plus it's his left arm.

Never one to bring speculation onto a LLL thread but I heard it is Dr. Candle's hand that is fake not the entire arm, but nonetheless, interesting.

Ah, many thanks! I was wondering if I'd find out what else that had to say besides BIIIIIIIGGGG MIIIIIIKE! LOL

Ooops. I don't think the link I gave you had that one.:redface:
But it sounds like you got everything worked out. The one from today is awesome...so much new information.

1 Adam 7, Alvarado & Reservoir (Streets)

2210 S. Veterans http://maps.yahoo.com/maps_result?addr=2210+S.+Veterans&csz=los+angeles%2C+ca&country=us&new=1&name=&qty=

They had a GPS Map up

Big Mike had a wedding ring on.

There are a few new promo photos for Collision up on lostmedia.

This one has a particularly nice close-up of Jason's necklace.
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=805&pos=22

There is also this one of Big Mike handcuffing Travis with wrists behind his back.
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=805&pos=19
There may be a canon issue here as far as adding it to the bondage list. I don't know if we actually saw this part of the scene during the ep. I think we only saw Big Mike crouched over Travis, but not handcuffing him. Anyone got their recording handy?

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=398 This is the cross I am talking about see the Red bowl on the shelf above Kate there are 2 shadows that make a cross.

There is the cross on Jason's shirt when A-L shoots him http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=820&pos=449Warning this is an up coming episode

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=847&pos=1 Can't spoiler font a link. It is from the "23rd Psalm"
another cross on Eko's stick There's also the mentioning of Kings Cross where they found Christian's body.

Quick question: What do you mean by
Suspicious Pen Sightings?
Why are they suspicious in the first place? That is, why are they on the list? I don't get the significance.
Thanks.

Quick question: What do you mean by
Suspicious Pen Sightings?
Why are they suspicious in the first place? That is, why are they on the list? I don't get the significance.
Thanks.There's the pens that Claire tried to use when she was signing the adoption papers.

Religious Symbolism

Anybody notice a possible allegory to the Lost Sheep parable with Jack Shephard
Matthew 18:12
How think ye? if a man have an hundred sheep, and one of them be gone astray, doth he not leave the ninety and nine, and goeth into the mountains, and seeketh that which is gone astray?

Jack getting ready to go get Sayid back (leaving the flock to go get the one)

Jack: Thank about what John? Shannon's dead, Sayid's being held at gunoint.

Eko: Stp! Please. What do you want?

Jack: Excuse me?

Eko: Peace? Revenge? Justice? And you are going out with all these guns? What do you want?

Jack: I want all of our people back here safely

Religious Symbolism

Anybody notice a possible allegory to the Lost Sheep parable with Jack Shephard


Jack getting ready to go get Sayid back (leaving the flock to go get the one)
And from the book of Matthew, no less.:)