Hi Folks,

Not sure if anyone noticed this, but it seemed to me that the cut wires above the lights in the dharma clinic were placed there more for show than an actual purpose in the plot.

As soon as Kate turned the power back on, those wires should have sparked or affected the main neon lighting in the hallway...

Not that it is truly important to the plot, but I find little details like that affect the feeling of "realism" in this episode.

You assume those wires had something to do with the lights, but they could have been for almost anything: Speaker system, sensor (heat, fire, Co2, ...) system, emergency backup systems.
Those systems would not spark id Kate hit a light switch or they were disconcerted. I think your looking for something that was not there. But that is the only way we find things sometimes!

i need to watch teh epi again but i think those cables were there when ethan and claire were walking around.

i need to watch teh epi again but i think those cables were there when ethan and claire were walking around.
That's possible, but I don't remember seeing them.

I thought it interesting that there was so much deterioration in the medical bunker -- rust coming down the tunnel walls -- when it wasn't all that deep, it wasn't under an apparent water source...

Then again... why did the other abandon the bunker? You've got a power source, a secure location...

And timeline...? How long ago was Claire abducted in island time? Maybe a month? Yet Claire finds it and it's been cleaned out, wires cut (potentially) and it's generally more run down than warrants (especially if it has been so sealed since the abduction). Personally, I'm wondering how much of her recall is real and how much may be false memory and/or induced by the psych experiments...

Are you saying that Claire wanted to believe she was in a very clean hospital like setting so that's what she saw? Especially with the drugged state she was in. Sort of like the dad on Alias when he thought he was going to the dr. and he was really going to that creepy warehouse?

Whoa, bport, that's wild! Whoa. :shock: As you can see, I'd never thought of that before or seen anyone else say it. What a fascinating idea. If that's so, then we can't exactly rely on her flashbacks in the med hatch for facts, can we?

Are you saying that Claire wanted to believe she was in a very clean hospital like setting so that's what she saw?
That is distinctly possible.
Let's not forget what other folk have seen in emotionally extreme states without all the drugs. If that wasn't it by itself, it certainly may have contributed.
Especially with the drugged state she was in. Sort of like the dad on Alias when he thought he was going to the dr. and he was really going to that creepy warehouse?
Yes, very much so.
Don't forget that "Alias" -- like "LOST" -- was a J.J. Abrams baby, so in terms of concept and plot-driving forces, there will be similarities.

Even if Claire was having some implanted memories, I feel that this was real. The wall where the pictures were hanging up showed of their outlines. Like if light was hitting a certain object for along time, the underneath is darker and the area around it has faded.

How do any of us know for a fact that it wasn't just another ruse perpetrated by Zeke & Co.? They may have trashed the place on purpose after Alex(?) let Claire go. If they truly abandoned it, then why did they make the effort to conceal it so well? Obviously they're still using it for something, and are storing things there that they're still using, like the dirty clothes and the theatrical makeup kit. There's a reason it appears abandoned and unused, and it's probably part of an elaborate manipulation to keep the Lostaways off balance.

But the rust? How can you fake rust?

But the rust? How can you fake rust?

How do we know it wasn't just a good "scenic job?" A little raw umber paint diluted w/ water will give you a really good rust effect. And the cut wires could certainly have just been "dressed" in. It's all for effect, just smoke and mirrors, like the clothes and the make-up box w/ Zeke's beard in it. Also, how do we know Kate wasn't "supposed" to find the stuff in the lockers???

As for the rust, that was there during Claire's flashback. I remember when Claire and Ethan were walking down the hallway to the nursery, there was rust on the wall. My husband even commented on it, finding it a bit odd.

I also think the med hatch has not been abandoned. It now seems to be a storage place for their clothing and costumes. I don't think they would ditch that stuff with the Losties still on the island. They may need them later. Plus, why leave all those flashlights in the cabinet near the door?

Phew, you're right. Rust is just a color, until closely examined.

Well, they certainly did do a good cover up job, if that's indeed what it was. There are nearly identical shots looking the main corridor. Here's the before, when Claire was a temporary visitor:
http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=980&pos=352

Here's the more recent shot when Claire/Rousseau/Kate visit:

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=980&pos=604

Most notably, in the Ethan pic, there is a doorway on the right labeled with "ESCAPE HATCH". It has either been painted over (?) or it was never there to begin with...

The escape hatch door *is* there, further down the corridor. You can't see the words above it (though someone in this (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=39359) 'Escape Hatch' thread said they could, very faintly). Those two pictures are just from slightly different angles. Still the same rust in both!

The escape hatch door *is* there, further down the corridor. You can't see the words above it (though someone in this (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=39359) 'Escape Hatch' thread said they could, very faintly). Those two pictures are just from slightly different angles. Still the same rust in both!

No, that's the same door. Look at the weird pentagon shaped handle area.

Hi Folks,
As soon as Kate turned the power back on, those wires should have sparked or affected the main neon lighting in the hallway...

Not that it is truly important to the plot, but I find little details like that affect the feeling of "realism" in this episode.

i'm sorry to say, but in real life, cut power cables do never spark when you put power on. they only do in hollywood movies, just like cars that explode when someone shoots the gas tank. it's just silly. your only clue that there's power is when you touch it, you'll probably die. but that is not really graphically pleasing for a movie audience, so sparks and lightning.

The loose wires just make me wonder what happened to that hatch. I don't see any reason the Others would have done it intentionally. Maybe something bad happened there recently. Like, the medicine fridge was knocked over. What's the point in the Others doing that? It was empty anyways.

What's the point in the Others doing that? It was empty anyways.

That might be more from the writer's point of view than from the other's. If they would have left the antidote, or any item from the baby room, then there would be proof. They could fetch Jack and all and show it off.

Now it all just seemed recklessly emptied, chaos, and nothing left anymore. It seems mainly storyline-driven: Why knock over cabinets and take off with a baby cradle and whatnot, and leave your camouflage pack, of all things.

Claire can not prove what happened this way, so next episode, there'll be no mention of it. I'm hoping the medical installation and the gear Kate found might loosen her lips, but I'm guessing we'll only see some light in the final episodes.

You assume those wires had something to do with the lights, but they could have been for almost anything: Speaker system, sensor (heat, fire, Co2, ...) system, emergency backup systems.
Those systems would not spark id Kate hit a light switch or they were disconcerted. I think your looking for something that was not there. But that is the only way we find things sometimes!
that's true. I hadn't thought about that. :)
100%
How do any of us know for a fact that it wasn't just another ruse perpetrated by Zeke & Co.? They may have trashed the place on purpose after Alex(?) let Claire go. If they truly abandoned it, then why did they make the effort to conceal it so well? Obviously they're still using it for something, and are storing things there that they're still using, like the dirty clothes and the theatrical makeup kit. There's a reason it appears abandoned and unused, and it's probably part of an elaborate manipulation to keep the Lostaways off balance.

I just thought of something... the cut wires/cables could be from when the dynamite was dropped into the hole to stop the machine from pulling Locke into the hole. (Or perhaps the writers put that in to keep us guessing and use our ideas in their next episode..) ;)

And as a result of the explosion, that part of the underground complex was damaged and forced them to vacate the premises. Only certain "non-essential" items like makeup/costume kits were left behind for future use or perhaps just left there during a quick evacuation.
100%
But the rust? How can you fake rust?

The rust could be from water damage after the dynamite explosion.
100%
i'm sorry to say, but in real life, cut power cables do never spark when you put power on. they only do in hollywood movies, just like cars that explode when someone shoots the gas tank. it's just silly. your only clue that there's power is when you touch it, you'll probably die. but that is not really graphically pleasing for a movie audience, so sparks and lightning.

In close promity to one another, yes, wires can spark when electrons arc over to the next closest conductor.
100%
The loose wires just make me wonder what happened to that hatch. I don't see any reason the Others would have done it intentionally. Maybe something bad happened there recently. Like, the medicine fridge was knocked over. What's the point in the Others doing that? It was empty anyways.

I think the dynamite explosion was after Claire's abduction (if my memory serves me correctly). So that would mean the cut wires could have come from that. As for the rust, after seeing the images from weasel-king's post, I think this rust just shows that these underground complexes have been around for a while.

The interesting tidbit was when the first hatch was opened with the Apple II computer.
Most of what was inside dated back to the early 80s (e.g. Apple computer). But, the laundry machines were new.... So obviously this has been an ongoing experiment.

It's the same hallway, same escape hatch, same everything. In the shot with Ethan the camera is much closer to the escape hatch, and it is shot with a shorter lens, and it's fully lit.

The shot with the empty hallway is lit much differently, and the camera is WAY back, and it's shot with a wide lens which gives things closer to camera more depth, it stretches them basically. So the bit of wall between the escape hatch, and the camera seems really long.

Anyway, it's the same hallway, just shot and lit differently.

Noeland-----------------------

Hi Folks,

Not sure if anyone noticed this, but it seemed to me that the cut wires above the lights in the dharma clinic were placed there more for show than an actual purpose in the plot.

As soon as Kate turned the power back on, those wires should have sparked or affected the main neon lighting in the hallway...

Not that it is truly important to the plot, but I find little details like that affect the feeling of "realism" in this episode.

and the lights were also all smashed and broken as well.. but there was no plastic/glass on the ground.. like it was all swept up.

http://www.lost-media.com/modules.php?name=coppermine&file=displayimage&album=980&pos=604

Oh.. maybe they're not lights (I thought they were the type of lights you see in classrooms. You know, the flat, flourescent ones that are a part of the ceiling?) but it looks like it's just the ceiling that was covering the electrical wiring.

Interesting thread - I don't know why I have a hard time believing that the evacuation was anything other than completely planned; unless the idea about the dynamite can really hold up (and it's intriguing) - these people are very good at what they do; the who thing (cut wires and all) seems very "dressed" to me, like a set with clues that were meant for the losties to find. Now why is another question...

I just thought of something... the cut wires/cables could be from when the dynamite was dropped into the hole to stop the machine from pulling Locke into the hole.

I had completely forgotten about that. Certainly something had to have been damaged in that explosion. Of course, I don't know if that had anything to do with the "evacuation". And the whole medical hatch tells a conflicting story. It appears as if everything was moved in a hurry or that something happened there, yet the costumes are still there nicely hanging in a locker. These costumes had to be important - equally important as the medical equipment - since they went to all the trouble to disquise themselves. I'm still thinking it looks staged...

Interesting thread - I don't know why I have a hard time believing that the evacuation was anything other than completely planned; unless the idea about the dynamite can really hold up (and it's intriguing) - these people are very good at what they do; the whole thing (cut wires and all) seems very "dressed" to me, like a set with clues that were meant for the losties to find. Now why is another question...

I absolutely agree that it was a complete setup. Some things they were meant to find, like the clothes and make-up kit w/ wig, and maybe even the stray baby bootie too. And some things they obviously were not meant to find: like the vaccine and the rest of the baby stuff. The dynamite theory is an interesting theory, but I think it's a stretch at best. There's just no evidence that the underground explosion caused the damage we saw in the medical hatch. It was all designed by The Others for our Losties to find it the way that they did, which in typical "Lost" fashion, raises many more questions than it actually answers. It looks and feels like a total setup, IMHO, and as usual we'll just have to wait and see exactly what the payoff will be.

I don't think those are hanging wires....I think they look more like roots that have grown down into the corridor from the trees aand plants above. It does not take long for a jungle to take over an abandoned area. Here in Georgia, we have a plant called kudzu that was imported from Asia that will grow a foot a day during rainy seasons!

There was some electricity flowing already because some lights were blinking wildly. Why then did Kate have to throw another power switch on? And how did she find it?

I don't think those are hanging wires....I think they look more like roots that have grown down into the corridor from the trees aand plants above.

Ah-ha!! I found someone to agree with me from another post I made, excellent! They do look more like overgrown roots growing in from above ground. The water stains are most likely caused from the tropical rainstorms which is leaking in through the ceiling where the roots have penetrated. Upon entering the main Medical Hatch, the ramp goes down, further underground. So, they're definitely underground there.

Something tells me that Medical Hatch/Bunker has been vacant for a long time, not just 3-4 weeks.

Another point - I don't think the fake beard that Kate found quite matches the fake beard that Zeke was wearing. Zeke seemed to be wearing a fuller beard.

Ah-ha!! I found someone to agree with me from another post I made, excellent! They do look more like overgrown roots growing in from above ground.

I have to admit, that was not an original thought on my part. I may have "borrowed" it from reading your other thread:redface:

There was some electricity flowing already because some lights were blinking wildly. Why then did Kate have to throw another power switch on? And how did she find it?

I didn't get that part either, especially since they conveniently left those working flashlights that were so easy for Kate & Co. to find. How come there was any power left in that place? Also, anybody speculate on what exactly is the power source for that bunker? Are we to assume it's from the electromagnetic generator buried behind the concrete walls in Desmond's bunker?

I don't think those are hanging wires....I think they look more like roots that have grown down into the corridor from the trees aand plants above.

I read this and re-watched... and now I also agree that what most people are calling "cut wires" are not wires at all, but are roots. I also think that this medical bunker being abandoned was completely staged. These roots could have even be props along with the spider web... used in order to make the medical bunker look like it had been abandoned a while ago. I also think that the items that were left in the bunker were meant to be found (fridge, bootie, rocking chair, costumes/beard).

It's the same hallway, same escape hatch, same everything. In the shot with Ethan the camera is much closer to the escape hatch, and it is shot with a shorter lens, and it's fully lit.

The shot with the empty hallway is lit much differently, and the camera is WAY back, and it's shot with a wide lens which gives things closer to camera more depth, it stretches them basically. So the bit of wall between the escape hatch, and the camera seems really long.

Anyway, it's the same hallway, just shot and lit differently.

Noeland-----------------------

Dude. The words "ESCAPE HATCH" are now missing above the door after da girls go visiting the place versus the flashback.

Why are the words "ESCAPE HATCH" now missing?

Dude. The words "ESCAPE HATCH" are now missing above the door after da girls go visiting the place versus the flashback.

Why are the words "ESCAPE HATCH" now missing?

I believe that the abandonment of this medical bunker was staged. Perhaps these words were painted over. "Escape Hatch" is such a peculiar term, notice is wasn't "emergency exit". When I hear "escape hatch" I kinda think of an escape pod or something mobile. Anyway... It's possible that Dharma did not want to reveal the term "escape hatch" just yet. Escape from who/what or escape to what/where? Maybe Dharma did not want the Losties thinking of these types of questions just yet. They removed the words "escape hatch" for that reason. Yes, the Losties will find the door, but will now be forced to draw their own conlusion as to what the door is used for.