I thought Sayid was supposed to scout the Others' camp, light the signal fire, and then wait for Jack and the others to meet up with him.

But instead Sayid does more than scout--he "goes Rambo". He goes ahead and searches each hut. In fact, he opens every door he can find. If the Others were actually there, he'd be in a heap of trouble. One against more than a dozen or so.

Then he (presumably) lights the signal fire. Later on, Sayid is shown back on the boat with Sun and Jin. I thought he was supposed to wait for Jack and the others on the beach.

Didn't seem like that good of a plan to me. Especially with the boat floating out there in broad daylight on a cloudless day... Also, I wonder how Sayid could get ashore undetected in said weather conditions...maybe he has gills...:biggrin:

Anyone else think Sayid's plan was poorly designed and executed? :biggrin:

We forget this one simple fact:

Sayid is the MOD EDIT_LANGUAGE man.

We forget this one simple fact:

Sayid is the MOD EDIT-LANGUAGE man.
Hee hee, so right!

I thought they sailed to some nearby beach area out of sight of the camp so that once he swam to land, he'd still have to hike a little ways. He'd still beat Jack's group back there. I think once he got there, it was so clearly deserted that he had to "go rambo" checking to make sure there really wasn't anyone there, but prepared to fight them off if they were hiding in the huts.

I wonder where the really do live.

We forget this one simple fact:

Sayid is the MOD EDIT-LANGUAGE man.

That's right. When Sayid says "scout the area," he means "kick down the doors and shoot everybody."

That's right. When Sayid says "scout the area," he means "kick down the doors and shoot everybody."
I guess Sayid should have said his plan was simply: "I'll kill 'em all (except for Walt). You just keep Michael occupied." :biggrin:

sayid, combat verteran, jack sawyer kate and hurley,,, regular types, adn 2 know how to at least point a gun. sayid i think intended to subdue the others if possible, and basically have dinner cooking when jack and company got there. this guy was republican Guard, no slouch

Hee hee, so right!
I wonder where the really do live.

In the barracks referred to in the Pearl video. That dock where they're waiting with Jack, Sawyer and Kate must be where the ferry makes its pick-ups.

Cardie

If you look closely at the sign on the docks, you can read "Pala Ferry" which is mentioned in the video. So the dock is definitely where the Ferry stops at.

haha i totally agree with baylady and digital... Sayid is the man, and he probably saw the desertedness and just played it by ear... kept goin closer and grew more and more privy to the fact that no one was there... Then, he still lit the fire for Jack and Co. and waited, probably just offshore (they didn't look like they were sailing, just floating/anchored), for them to arrive.. Hopefully we'll get to see some good rescue attempts when Jack and them never show up!!!



That is, unless they are awaiting this Pala Ferry and are already gone by then.

I think he was smart enough to see everyone was gone. Not a giant group of women and children left to tend the camp.

I want to know why he got back on the boat with Jin and Sun. Does anyone have any ideas?

I think Sayid and Jin & Sun on the boat are quite a wildcard for the start of S3. They might intercept Michael -- and believe me, Sayid will cut Michael no slack. Or they could come around and interfere with the Others taking J/K/S away.

I had no problem with Sayid "scouting" a deserted camp by kicking open doors. When he found the circumstances had changed, he probably figured he'd best get back on the fastest vehicle to give him an advantage on what might come next.

It reminded me of the second episode of 24's third season. Jack Bauer is at a crack house and he kicks down the door then points the gun left and right inside the room.

I keep thinking that they'll sail around and possibly save the day at the Pala (sp) Ferry or at least kick some other tail.

By the way I think that Sayid used the inflatable to get to and from shore.

I think that when he found that empty village, he knew that they'd be intercepted on the way to the village. So he lit the fire to show that he'd gotten there (hoping Jack would wonder what was up, which Jack did, before being tranquilized). Then he hightailed it back along the coast with Jin and Sun to find his buddies.

Yeah...Sayid's not an idiot...Once got to Camp Other and realized that the camp was deserted...he felt safe enough to do some exploring on his own. He immediately realized that Michael was NOT leading the Listies back there...so he lit the signal fire on the beach...jumped in the launch raft and paddled his a$$ back to the sailboat. (No...Sayid does not have gills!!)

But with no idea where Mike was leading the Listies, they really couldn't do much but watch the beach and hope The Listies showed up. But at least from the sailboat, they'd be in less danger than hanging out on the beach next to a big signal fire...that the Others might see and investigate.

My guess for the Season 3 opener...Night will begin to fall...and the Listies will have NOT showed up at the beach...and Sayid, Jin & Sun will use the cover of night to continue sailing around the island...I think they'll find the dock and tie up there...perhaps they'll see torches moving off into the distance and figure they've found the Others...I think he'll send Jin and Sun back (Sun IS preggers afterall) for reinforcements...and Sayid will track the Others on foot by himself...Rambo style.

I do believe Mike's boat will be intercepted...but not by Capt'n Jin & crew...I think another Other's boat will meet up with Mike...Walt will be taken back...and Mike will meet Ana in Hell.

That's my theory....and I'm stickin' to it. :biggrin:

Yeah...Sayid's not an idiot...Once got to Camp Other and realized that the camp was deserted...he felt safe enough to do some exploring on his own. He immediately realized that Michael was NOT leading the Listies back there...so he lit the signal fire on the beach...jumped in the launch raft and paddled his a$$ back to the sailboat. (No...Sayid does not have gills!!)

But with no idea where Mike was leading the Listies, they really couldn't do much but watch the beach and hope The Listies showed up. But at least from the sailboat, they'd be in less danger than hanging out on the beach next to a big signal fire...that the Others might see and investigate.

My guess for the Season 3 opener...Night will begin to fall...and the Listies will have NOT showed up at the beach...and Sayid, Jin & Sun will use the cover of night to continue sailing around the island...I think they'll find the dock and tie up there...perhaps they'll see torches moving off into the distance and figure they've found the Others...I think he'll send Jin and Sun back (Sun IS preggers afterall) for reinforcements...and Sayid will track the Others on foot by himself...Rambo style.

I do believe Mike's boat will be intercepted...but not by Capt'n Jin & crew...I think another Other's boat will meet up with Mike...Walt will be taken back...and Mike will meet Ana in Hell.

That's my theory....and I'm stickin' to it. :biggrin:

That sounds like a likely scenario. Oh yeah, Ana Lucia is waiting for Mike in hell...if only to inflict proper vengeance and then go on back to purgatory -- I think she resolved her issues right before she died.

"Listies!" LOL, that's perfect, Ator.

Cardie

Once Sayid found the camp deserted , he should have figured the Others had gone out to "meet " the Losties. Being a smart fellow, he would have realized that the Others would not trust Michael completly. A traitor is not to be trusted by either side. And did Sayid really light the signal knowing there ws probably an ambush in the works orwas that really smokie?

I like how Sayid had a gun in his hand and 2 handguns in the back of his pants. All he needed was the shoulder bullet clip to totally have a rambo moment. Oh well, if anyone can take down all the others single handidly, its definetly Sayid. He's bad ***, and thats the reason he is my favorite character. Lets hope he kills some others next season.

How do we explain this?

SAYID: On the way to the funeral I told you that Michael had been compromised by the Others, and then you asked me how we might take advantage of that. I believe fate has given us our answer -- the boat.
JACK: The boat?
SAYID: This camp Michael is leading you to across the island -- that is where they will set their trap. While Michael leads you by land, I can approach far more quickly by sea. And I can go ashore undetected.
JACK: Go ashore and do what?
SAYID: Scout them -- their numbers and positions, their weapons. Then I'll go to the nearest beach and start a signal fire with these [he holds up some leaves]. They burn with a dark, black smoke. You and your team will come to meet me at the signal and we will go in together.
JACK: We're not even sure if Michael's been turned by them.
SAYID: He has been turned.
JACK: I'll have to tell Kate, and Hurley and Sawyer what we're doing.
SAYID: No. Michael cannot sense we know he is lying. All we have is the element of surprise, Jack. Right now it's only your responsibility to keep it secret.
JACK: Black smoke, huh?
SAYID: This time they will know that we are coming.

Huh?

Michael's gun didn't have bullets in them. I think that was the key (the element of surprise) to Sayid's plan. Jack was planning on leading the four towards the black smoke and Michael would've had no say. They then would have proceeded as planned. Sayid had no way of anticipating the Hurley bird nor the poison (?) darts. That's how I am understanding the above dialogue.

You've all gotta keep in mind that the Republican Guard didn't have the greatest war record or planning.... Iraq was crushed in under a week.

Yeah...Sayid's not an idiot...Once got to Camp Other and realized that the camp was deserted...he felt safe enough to do some exploring on his own. He immediately realized that Michael was NOT leading the Listies back there...so he lit the signal fire on the beach...jumped in the launch raft and paddled his a$$ back to the sailboat. (No...Sayid does not have gills!!)

But with no idea where Mike was leading the Listies, they really couldn't do much but watch the beach and hope The Listies showed up. But at least from the sailboat, they'd be in less danger than hanging out on the beach next to a big signal fire...that the Others might see and investigate.

My guess for the Season 3 opener...Night will begin to fall...and the Listies will have NOT showed up at the beach...and Sayid, Jin & Sun will use the cover of night to continue sailing around the island...I think they'll find the dock and tie up there...perhaps they'll see torches moving off into the distance and figure they've found the Others...I think he'll send Jin and Sun back (Sun IS preggers afterall) for reinforcements...and Sayid will track the Others on foot by himself...Rambo style.

I do believe Mike's boat will be intercepted...but not by Capt'n Jin & crew...I think another Other's boat will meet up with Mike...Walt will be taken back...and Mike will meet Ana in Hell.

That's my theory....and I'm stickin' to it. :biggrin:
I agree with most of your theory, especially the part regarding the start of Season 3. I think they will use the boat to explore the island further, and who knows whom they will meet (Michael's boat? the Pala Ferry?). The only point on which I disagree is the fire. I don't think Sayid would light a fire knowing that the Others are not where he expected them and that they are probably ambushed.

If you look closely at the sign on the docks, you can read "Pala Ferry" which is mentioned in the video. So the dock is definitely where the Ferry stops at.

Hmm.. I know kind of off topic. But, I'm reading Huxley's "Island" right now and the island that the book describes is Pala.. Also the enviroment/principles that this book describes really makes me feel like i'm on the losties island. Wonder if this may of been insperation for the writers....

I thought Sayid was supposed to scout the Others' camp, light the signal fire, and then wait for Jack and the others to meet up with him.

But instead Sayid does more than scout--he "goes Rambo". He goes ahead and searches each hut. In fact, he opens every door he can find. If the Others were actually there, he'd be in a heap of trouble. One against more than a dozen or so.

Then he (presumably) lights the signal fire. Later on, Sayid is shown back on the boat with Sun and Jin. I thought he was supposed to wait for Jack and the others on the beach.

Didn't seem like that good of a plan to me. Especially with the boat floating out there in broad daylight on a cloudless day... Also, I wonder how Sayid could get ashore undetected in said weather conditions...maybe he has gills...:biggrin:

Anyone else think Sayid's plan was poorly designed and executed? :biggrin:

My problem was not so much with the execution as with the design. Him going into the camp/village with guns drawn may be explained by the fact that he realized that the camp was more or less deserted. I don't think he would have done that if there had been people milling about. As it was, maybe he was hoping he would find someone left behind whom he could coerce into giving him information. As for him getting on the boat...maybe he thought it would give them a better chance of getting to wherever it was he was planning on heading to next, I'm not sure.

But as for the plan, there were several things I didn't understand, and I'm not sure if thats because of the plan itself or my own poor grasp of strategy lol. Ok let's see: the plan is for J/K/S/H to pretend to go along with Michael, making the Others think that they're coming, so that while they are presumably distracted Sayid can survey their camp. Then Sayid would sail to a safe distance, make a signal and join them, and then what? Start a war?

Questions:
1. If the plan relied so much on stealth, why make a big signal fire "so that this time they would know that WE are coming?" Ok, lets say the "element of surprise" was only vital until Sayid checked out their camp, but you would think that calling attention to themselves like that would still compromise them somehow. Was there simply no other way to arrange a meeting point?
2. What made Sayid think that adding himself and perhaps Jin to the party would improve their chances against the Others?
3. How can Sayid be sure his friends wouldn't be intercepted on their way to meet him? He couldn't know at which point they'd be on the island when he lit the fire, and it would be highly likely that the Others were either tracking them or keeping an eye on them to make sure Michael was following orders (which is what happened).

As far as I can see, using the boat to check out Michael's story and learn something about their enemy was not a bad idea, but wouldn't it have been much smarter to have that knowledge in hand BEFORE going out into the jungle with Michael? i.e- collect that information first and discuss it back in the safety of their own camp and decide how many people and weapons would be needed.

I know I'm missing something here...:confused: ...can anyone enlighten me?

You're not missing a thing. The plot required that J/K/S be captured by the Others and Michael and Walt given passage off the island. So Sayid's plan had to be designed to fail. I think the main motivation for the journey on the sail boat was to reveal the four-toed statue.

Cardie

Did you see the look Jack gave Kate at the end of S2 i think she secretly knew as a back up i think Sawyer saw it to wouldnt be surprised if Jack or Kate have a dagger tucked away when they are ready to use it then there is Hurley cant see him abandoning his friends. and Sayid of course he rocks i think he was just searching the area and putting up the fire to tell Jack there was no one there i was expecting more in the room though

Did you see the look Jack gave Kate at the end of S2 i think she secretly knew as a back up i think Sawyer saw it to wouldnt be surprised if Jack or Kate have a dagger tucked away when they are ready to use it then there is Hurley cant see him abandoning his friends. and Sayid of course he rocks i think he was just searching the area and putting up the fire to tell Jack there was no one there i was expecting more in the room though

I doubt that either Jack or Kate has a hidden weapon on them. The first thing the Others probably did after capturing them was check them for any extra weapons that Jack, Kate, Sawyer, or Hurley would have been carrying.

You've all gotta keep in mind that the Republican Guard didn't have the greatest war record or planning.... Iraq was crushed in under a week.

Gulf war 1 or 2?

i agree, i think it was dumb of sayid to plan on sending up black smoke once he'd scouted the others. i mean, he even says, "then, ill go to the NEAREST beach and light a signal fire"...nearest beach? wow, then do what, sit there til micheal and company arrive...in who knows how long? seems pretty stupid to me. the others would for sure either get out of there thereby thwarting their plans of giving walt back to michael, or go find out who was sending up that smoke. either way...not a smooth move.

also, i had forgotten about the whole "sending up black smoke" thing that the others used to do. i remember danielle says thats what they do when they're coming...yet we havent seen any black smoke, other than smokie, since the first season. and we've seen a whole lot more of the others. i suppose it's been more the losties seeking out the others in season 2, but the whole idea of the smoke seems dumb to me. i mean, why announce their arrival? and they certainly didnt send up black smoke to the tailies. they just came and plucked them out of the night...maybe there really are 2 different groups of others

The black smoke is to signal with the Others are coming in force.

As far as I can tell, the element of surprise was to surprise Michael. I think Sayid assumed the Others would be keeping an eye on Michael and Co.

Sayid was to scout the Others' camp by sea, while they were distracted watching Mike & Co. approach by land. Based on what he found, he would pick an appropriate place to light a signal fire. But Sayid would not stay there.

The signal fire was both signal and distraction. A signal for Jack to ambush Mike (whose gun was unloaded) and then meet Sayid at a disclosed place, probably a specified distance away from the fire. A distraction because the others would have to send soem of their forces to the signal fire to investigate, but nobody would be there when the Others arrived.

The Others have now split their forces into three groups. One watching Jack, one watching the signal fire and one at home base. It's risky, but it's not unsound.

The problem was that they assumed the Others had about the same technology as the Losties -- some guns, huts, salvaged technology. They didn't know the Others had cordless tasers. They didn't anticipate that Michael would not be bringing them anywhere near the village. They didn't anticipate that the Others had constructed an entire fake village.

At least, I doubt they anticipated any of that. The problem with the theory that them getting captured was part of Sayid's plan is that their plan couldn't anticpate that 1) the village was a fake and 2) Sayid now has no frickin clue where they are.

Sayid has no other plan than to wait on the rest of the Iraqi Army to build up their numbers after fighting the insurgency and they will eventually come to the aid of the Losties. This will occur after American troops are out of Iraq, which may take a long time, so it looks like several more seasons of Lost, woohoo! Iraquis never leave a man behind.

We don't KNOW that Sayid lit the fire.

1. Sayid explains to Jack that he will light a fire.

2. Jack sees smoke.

What is the relationship between these 2 facts? Not absolutely clear.

Danielle (or somebody) has a history of setting signal fires on the beach . . .

Or as someone else suggested, could be Smokey.

Danielle (or somebody) has a history of setting signal fires on the beach . . .
Or as someone else suggested, could be Smokey.

I'm not sure Danielle set the first fire on the beach in Exodus. Did they confirm that she did? I do remember in Exodus,

[In the distance we see the black smoke is coming from a fire on the beach. Sayid and Charlie approach the fire.]
CHARLIE: What the hell is that?
SAYID: There's no footprints, no tracks.

At least, I doubt they anticipated any of that. The problem with the theory that them getting captured was part of Sayid's plan is that their plan couldn't anticpate that 1) the village was a fake and 2) Sayid now has no frickin clue where they are.

The part about them planning on getting caught haas to do with the new plan people think they made after findong out Micheal wasn't taking them towards the coast. Sayid wouldn't know this and so would still light his fire.

Of course he still has no frickin clue where they are... :rolleyes:

All of these "plan B" theories seem to assume Sayid is coming to the rescue.

I think Ator called it- Sayid will lead the rescue journey while J/S/K are under the "influence" (eek) of the Others in S3.

Re: the looks passing between J/S/K- I was actually reading threads right now to see if anyone has mentioned it here. It's not on THIS topic (or is it?), but Sawyer sure was left out of the lingering, meaningful looks and the despair on his face was awesome acting (ok, not on the point). But that part of the scene is something really important I think, if not because like someone suggested it points to a "message" between J/K, but also I felt it pointed to an even more out-of-control Sawyer in the upcoming season if he cannot depend on any of his "friends". (Have you ever noticed how often he used that word about Michael, Jin, Jack who are always ready to turn on him?) Hm. Maybe not Rambo, more like... Capt. Kurtz. (As a young Brando of course- LOL!)