Anyone out there willing/able to translate for us?

I am soooo subscribing to this thread! Whatever they said, it sure seemed like a heated argument. Hopefully not just "Kill me! Do it!", but maybe "Kill me! or they'll find out about the ____!" Can't wait for someone to figure it out and tell us!

i dont know russian but my bet is that Ms Klugh told him to shoot her.

We know basically what was said, but I definitely need more information.

Possibly more importantly the manuscript, the paper that Locke pulls from by the typewriter. It's in Russian, and it's marked up in red ink in Russian. I think. I paused my VCR. Definitely the typset is Russian, but maybe not the red ink. But I think it is.

Help anyone? Screencaps and translations?

i dont know russian but my bet is that Ms Klugh told him to shoot her.

I don't speak any Russian either, but that was what I figured she was saying too.

From Lostpedia (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Enter_77)

Klugh: Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: We have another way.
Klugh: They know us. We will ot let them [unintelligible]. You know what to do. It is an order.
Mikhail: But we still have another way! (pause) I'm sorry! (shoots) (End)

Sign me up, too! I can't wait for someone to post a translation for this scene! :ohmy:

Yeah, I agree there ^ but I am sure more was said than just that. So I'm subscribing to this thread too, in hopes of a linguist coming along. ;)

Yes, I want to know both the conversation and the manuscript.

Klugh spoke Russian? Dude, didn't see that one coming.

*waiting patiently*

From Lostpedia (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Enter_77)

Klugh: Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: We have another way.
Klugh: They know us. We will ot let them [unintelligible]. You know what to do. It is an order.
Mikhail: But we still have another way! (pause) I'm sorry! (shoots) (End)

Makes sense. I hope there's more to it. I think it'll take someone at Lostpedia a little longer on the manuscript question. ;)

Bella_Harmon does. Maybe she'll join us soon. I sent her a PM

Wow, ame, you snuck in there!

Ok, that wasn't too revealing, but lostpedia sure was quick. So they have orders. Very illuminating... :rolleyes:

From Lostpedia (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Enter_77)

Klugh: Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have another way.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: We have another way.
Klugh: They know us. We will ot let them [unintelligible]. You know what to do. It is an order.
Mikhail: But we still have another way! (pause) I'm sorry! (shoots) (End)

It was posted three posts ago...adding comments just bumps this into oblivion

They were yelling about how they were going to tell Fearless Leader that moose and squirrel got away again.

We still need a translation of the Russian manuscript.

So we know that whatever the Hostiles (Others) are protecting they are willing to both kill and die for it.

It was posted three posts ago...adding comments just bumps this into oblivion
Sorry Diabolo. I think in the posting frenzy you can miss something that gets posted 30 seconds before you submit. That's what happened to me.

This episode gave a lot of information that indicates that the Others (whoever they are) have a lot of protocols in place to deal with infiltration of their camps. They take the threats very, very seriously. I hope we are starting to get closer to the core mystery of what the island is, and why protocol dictates death in the case of any breach.

They were yelling about how they were going to tell Fearless Leader that moose and squirrel got away again.

Only the Council of Elders will get that one.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :rotflmao2: :rotflmao2:

Er--what is "another way"?

See? TPTB have managed to introduce yet another question! :rolleyes:

Sorry Diabolo. I think in the posting frenzy you can miss something that gets posted 30 seconds before you submit. That's what happened to me.

This episode gave a lot of information that indicates that the Others (whoever they are) have a lot of protocols in place to deal with infiltration of their camps. They take the threats very, very seriously. I hope we are starting to get closer to the core mystery of what the island is, and why protocol dictates death in the case of any breach.

No worries ;) you can see three people quoted it ahead of me before I could get my post in either...new episode, great episode and a lot of excitement!! Yay! Lost is back!

Only the Council of Elders will get that one.
:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :rotflmao2: :rotflmao2:

Glad you liked it. I can't claim to being a really legit Elder, though; I'm in my early 20s and watched the show because it was in reruns on Cartoon Network when I was younger. So I'm kind of a fake. ;)

OH -- but on that note -- I hope Mikhail lasts long enough to meet Sawyer, so that Sawyer can nickname him "Boris" or "Fearless Leader."

This is what I just copied from Lostpedia http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Enter_77 I copied and pasted everything relating to the manuscript posted so far. I'm sure this will be updated by the morning.



Translation of the Russian printed page, what little fragments can be seen:

.. lost in his land, and they most
... necessary, through complete social
(break)
...
...pushed away Andrew (underlined). Nadji was not
... resistance, however he was an excellent
... (either half or something else) brother, however he was an excellent
... one of the north-western
(break, paper scrolls down)
.. radicals of that time...
...about that they (something) the West and...
...road of Allah, so that he erased from the face of the earth (looks like) unbelievers...
... Andrew thought, that the fall of Afghanistan will become ...
... of revolution
... came today, so that Nadji with a strong ...
... russian language.
... ICI (some Russian acronym) will be ...

That is all I can read. I apologize if this has not been formatted properly. Someone please fix.


The first red note written in Russian handwriting on the page mentions something like, "My nickname was Andrew also" or something similar. I cannot make out one word; will wait for HD version. The second red note written in Russian: "I have forgotten so much about Afghanistan" The printed text talks about the West, Agfhanistan, Allah and revolution.
[edit] Trivia

I hope Mikhail lasts long enough to meet Sawyer, so that Sawyer can nickname him "Boris" or "Fearless Leader."

He'll only get a chance after his "week" is up. Glad to see that classic cartoons live on.

The first red note written in Russian handwriting on the page mentions something like, "My nickname was Andrew also" or something similar. [edit] Trivia
Interesting. Another saint, an apostle, comes into the fold. St. Andrew is the patron saint of Russia..

Andre is a very common Russian name - from what I could make out it seemed like Andre was a code name - the 1st red handwritten note tipped me off - it wouldn't be unusual for two men to share that name unless it meant something.

This is what I just copied from Lostpedia http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Enter_77 I copied and pasted everything relating to the manuscript posted so far. I'm sure this will be updated by the morning.



Translation of the Russian printed page, what little fragments can be seen:

.. lost in his land, and they most
... necessary, through complete social
(break)
...
...pushed away Andrew (underlined). Nadji was not
... resistance, however he was an excellent
... (either half or something else) brother, however he was an excellent
... one of the north-western
(break, paper scrolls down)
.. radicals of that time...
...about that they (something) the West and...
...road of Allah, so that he erased from the face of the earth (looks like) unbelievers...
... Andrew thought, that the fall of Afghanistan will become ...
... of revolution
... came today, so that Nadji with a strong ...
... russian language.
... ICI (some Russian acronym) will be ...

That is all I can read. I apologize if this has not been formatted properly. Someone please fix.


The first red note written in Russian handwriting on the page mentions something like, "My nickname was Andrew also" or something similar. I cannot make out one word; will wait for HD version. The second red note written in Russian: "I have forgotten so much about Afghanistan" The printed text talks about the West, Agfhanistan, Allah and revolution.
[edit] Trivia

Was Sayid's alias also Nadji?

What I found interesting...is that Klugh told him it was an ORDER...is this some sort of paramilitary organization? Ranks?

LOST is back!!!

Fascinating.

What I found interesting...is that Klugh told him it was an ORDER...is this some sort of paramilitary organization? Ranks?

I used to work for a Navy sub-contractor... All those books (food drop protocol, operations manual...) smacked of military. Klugh telling him it's an order to kill her was probably protocol... If you're captured, it's better to die. Maybe that way you can't be tortured into talking..

I've improved the Lostpedia's version just a wee bit:

Klugh: Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail: We still have a way out.
Klugh: We cannot risk. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: There's another way out.
Klugh: They know us [OR They've recognized us]. We will ot let them [unintelligible]. You know what to do. It is an order.
Mikhail: But we still have a way out!
Klugh: [in English] Just do it Mikhail!
(pause)
Mikhail: I'm sorry! (shoots) (End)

It's not just another 'way' they talk about it's the 'way out' - the word could mean literally a way out of a building for instance or a way out of a tough situation.

http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage.php?album=1261&pos=265 The page
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Anyone out there willing/able to translate for us?

Doctor Pjegice,

Can you copy and edit the translations into your 1st post? It's easy to point people in the right direction.

Hallo!
Of course, I speak russian. What I have to translate? I did not see Enter 77 yet (i hope to watch it tomorrow). But if you can tell me what words, sentences I have to translate, I'll help you right now :rolleyes:

What I found interesting...is that Klugh told him it was an ORDER...is this some sort of paramilitary organization? Ranks?

LOST is back!!!
that would make her his superior. Very interesting.

My take on the manuscript:

.. were lost in his country, and they must
...by force and, if necessary, through complete social
(break)
...
...in some way pushed away Andrei (underlined). Nadji was not
... Afghan resistance, however he was an excellent
... He was a second cousin of an influential
... who controlled one of the north-western
... specialist, who helped
... mojahedins used against Soviet
... Nadji made up for [lack of] courage with intelligence and
... fundamentalist. As all radicals of that time, Nadji
... his medrese believed that they were holding back the West and...
... preparing the road for Allah, so he could wipe the unbelievers off the face of the earth
whereas Andrei thought, that the fall of Afghanistan will become an impulse to...
... [worldwide] social revolution
... 'Pakistanis arrived today', Nadji said in grandiloquent Russian with a strong accent.
... We knew that ISI would be involved in this.
... say this?' Andrei knew that
... 'I thought that you...

ISI is Pakistani intelligence. See here http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Inter-Services_Intelligence

The name Andrei is underlined in red and the note on the right says 'My name is Andrei, too' [it's 'name' not 'nickname']. So is Mikhail actually Andrei, or is/was there another Russian around? Yippee, Russians are coming!
The second red note next to 'social revolution' says 'I've forgotten so much about Afghanistan.'

The name Andrei is underlined in red and the note on the right says 'My name is Andrei, too' [it's 'name' not 'nickname']. So is Mikhail actually Andrei, or is/was there another Russian around? Yippee, Russians are coming!
Anrdei could be also Ukrainian or Belorussian. Andrei is very popular name in Russia, Ukraine, Belorussia (Belarus).

Andrei is a Russian form of Andrew

My take on the military thing is; Kelvin was US military, Goodwin had some manner of military training, Mikhail was former Russian military, it seems quite a few of the Others/Hostiles/Dharma have military backgrounds.

Besides that, of the castaways, Desmond was Royal Scots and Sayid was Iraqi Republican Guard.

So was he writing his memoirs or non-fiction about his life? It seems as though he was writing because he had a lot of time on his hands.


Klugh: They know us [OR They've recognized us]. We will ot let them [unintelligible]. You know what to do. It is an order.



Thanks for the translation, just one question, is this line supposed to be "we will not let them" instead of "we will ot let them?"

I think the paper refers to the Afghan/Russian conflict of the late 70's early 80's. Going on what Thwackum posted about ISI (Pakistani Intelligence) which was heavily involved in the conflict also. Also the paper refers to Naji or Nadji??

The President of Afghanistan at the time of the conflict and all the way up to 1992 was President Najibullah.

So to me it seems the paper is discussing the strategies/ramifications etc in the Afghan/Soviet conflict. Obviously a strong connection to Patchy given his background.

hmm whether it's an academic paper or a story/memoir, why is he writing it?

maybe he's just really bored out at the farm so he decided to write his memoirs?

'Russia,Afghanistan and Other things.'

:grin:

Seriously though, some of 'the others' seem to have a scientific leaning. Ethan, Juliet etc. Maybe patchys specialty is military history, politics and strategy.

Or maybe theres some kind of analogy with the Dharma/Other conflict. A small band of rebels versus an authority backed up by a very powerful nation.

Thanks for the translation, just one question, is this line supposed to be "we will not let them" instead of "we will ot let them?"

Yes, sir (ma'am)! Sorry for the slip. "We will not let them" is correct.
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hmm whether it's an academic paper or a story/memoir, why is he writing it?

Given the style and direct speech quotes in the text, it definitely looks like a story/memoir, not an academic paper. And it's definitely about Afghan/Soviet conflict in the 80s. Good point: Nadji = Nadjibullah.
Now, there may be all kinds of ideas as far as the authorship is concerned. My impression is the manuscript was written/typed by one person but the notes in red pen were left by another one, named Andrei. So there are at least 2 Russian-speakers involved.

My bet : the story/page written in Russian is the real Flame's DHARMA dude backstory, and Mikhail had to "learn" his story to become him, just as Benjamin Linus for Henry Gale.

Mikhail was former Russian military

:no2:
Actually, former SOVIET military :)
And Kiev is the capital of the Ukraine, former Ukrainian SSR

Er--what is "another way"?

See? TPTB have managed to introduce yet another question! :rolleyes:



sigh -- im getting sick of those questions - mayhaps they should learn to finish a job instead of changing tracks halfway through every plot line.

Love this show but damn i hate how the producers just keep stringing us allong.

My question is:

Why are they a pain about it? When sayid spoke arab he got subtitles. -- expecially in a day in age where the show analyzed so darn much -- why the trouble to the viewer? Did what they were ACTUALLY saying really give away anything?

Here i thought it was going to be some huge clue -- but instead they threw us that "suprising" curve of the enemy falling on his sword instead of being taken prisoner. A plot twist so old its in the bible.

Great episode though - just really disappointing that the uninelligble phrases were only the least bit different than the predictable "shoot me ive been captured"

My bet : the story/page written in Russian is the real Flame's DHARMA dude backstory, and Mikhail had to "learn" his story to become him, just as Benjamin Linus for Henry Gale.

That would make sense, but why would he call himself Mikhail if manuscript AND the note on it said Andrei?

That would make sense, but why would he call himself Mikhail if manuscript AND the note on it said Andrei?

Did it say that his name was Andrei or that his nickname was Andrei ? Because if it is his nickname, then maybe his real name was Mikhail (although I agree that wouldn't make much sense). Anyway, maybe Mikhail was too busy to learn DHARMA dude's real name ! :biggrin:

That would make sense, but why would he call himself Mikhail if manuscript AND the note on it said Andrei?
Maybe there were 2 of them on Flame station, Like Kelvin and Radzinsky on Swan station. One of them was Andrei :) And the other one was Mikhail?

Did it say that his name was Andrei or that his nickname was Andrei ? Because if it is his nickname, then maybe his real name was Mikhail (although I agree that wouldn't make much sense). Anyway, maybe Mikhail was too busy to learn DHARMA dude's real name ! :biggrin:

The red note says literally 'My name is Andrei, too'
NOT nickname.
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Maybe there were 2 of them on Flame station, Like Kelvin and Radzinsky on Swan station. On of them was Andrei :) And the other one was Mikhail?

This sounds good. Definitely possible.

Maybe Mikhail is new to the others.

We now know that Ms Klugh speaks russian, maybe she can write it. If Mikhail is new to this then he would need a back story and fast. He didn't seem to know that Ms Klugh knew Kate and vice versa when she said that "they recognise us" just before Mikhail shot Ms Klugh.

Maybe Ms Klugh typed the back story for him in a hurry. After the kidnappings we've seen nothing of Ms Klugh. Maybe she gets on the horse to warn the others that are dotted around the island that they have captured losties and there maybe a search party. She gets to Mikhail last, types up a story in a hurry and goes to hide as Kate, Sayid, Locke and Danielle arive.

Bit farfetched i know but it's possible.

My bet : the story/page written in Russian is the real Flame's DHARMA dude backstory, and Mikhail had to "learn" his story to become him, just as Benjamin Linus for Henry Gale.

That would mean Mikhail is not really Russian or he could make up his own backstory. Not sure about that. Do you think he's not really Mikhail? I suppose he could have taken the name of a former Dharma operative.

Why are they a pain about it? When sayid spoke arab he got subtitles. -- expecially in a day in age where the show analyzed so darn much -- why the trouble to the viewer? Did what they were ACTUALLY saying really give away anything?

Because they know we think its fun. :) But the real answer is simple, it's about POVs. When the person whose POV we are in understands the language being spoken (like in the Kwon's backstory) we get subtitles. When a language is being spoken around people who don't understand the language (like Jin on the beach in In Translation or here in this scene) we got nothing. It's meant to show you the confusion of Kate, Locke and Sayid because they didn't understand them.

Thanks to all the Russian speakers who came to our aid in this thread! I love how multi-national we are. They had to know we'd tackle this one easily. (I'm still blown away that we found someone who could read lips upside down :biggrin: ).

My take on the manuscript:

.. were lost in his country, and they must
...by force and, if necessary, through complete social
(break)
...
...in some way pushed away Andrei (underlined). Nadji was not
... Afghan resistance, however he was an excellent
... He was a second cousin of an influential
... who controlled one of the north-western
... specialist, who helped
... mojahedins used against Soviet
... Nadji made up for [lack of] courage with intelligence and
... fundamentalist. As all radicals of that time, Nadji
... his medrese believed that they were holding back the West and...
... preparing the road for Allah, so he could wipe the unbelievers off the face of the earth
whereas Andrei thought, that the fall of Afghanistan will become an impulse to...
... [worldwide] social revolution
... 'Pakistanis arrived today', Nadji said in grandiloquent Russian with a strong accent.
... We knew that ISI would be involved in this.
... say this?' Andrei knew that
... 'I thought that you...

Definitely about the Soviet/Afghani conflict. Thanks so much for the translation.

Question - we know Sayid's father was a big war hero of some kind in Iraq. Could he tie in to this history somehow?

But the real answer is simple, it's about POVs. When the person whose POV we are in understands the language being spoken (like in the Kwon's backstory) we get subtitles. When a language is being spoken around people who don't understand the language (like Jin on the beach in In Translation or here in this scene) we got nothing. It's meant to show you the confusion of Kate, Locke and Sayid because they didn't understand them.
Totally agree. Good point.

My take on the military thing is; Kelvin was US military, Goodwin had some manner of military training, Mikhail was former Russian military, it seems quite a few of the Others/Hostiles/Dharma have military backgrounds.

Besides that, of the castaways, Desmond was Royal Scots and Sayid was Iraqi Republican Guard.

And remember, Pickett used the military slang term "klicks."

That would make sense, but why would he call himself Mikhail if manuscript AND the note on it said Andrei?

I'd say his really name is Andrei. The paper looks to be what the Dharma person there before was writing out of boredom, etc. Since their are red marks on it like someone proofreading it, I say that Mikhail was reading it and making notes for his new persona. I also think that maybe he gave Mikhail as a name is that it goes in with the sterotype Russian. Mikhail (Gorbechev) and Nadia (the gymnist...I can't for the life of me spell her last name) just further that.

So is Mikhail actually Andrei, or is/was there another Russian around? Yippee, Russians are coming!


Everybody to get from street!

sigh -- im getting sick of those questions - mayhaps they should learn to finish a job instead of changing tracks halfway through every plot line.

Love this show but damn i hate how the producers just keep stringing us allong.

My question is:

Why are they a pain about it? When sayid spoke arab he got subtitles. -- expecially in a day in age where the show analyzed so darn much -- why the trouble to the viewer? Did what they were ACTUALLY saying really give away anything?

Here i thought it was going to be some huge clue -- but instead they threw us that "suprising" curve of the enemy falling on his sword instead of being taken prisoner. A plot twist so old its in the bible.

Great episode though - just really disappointing that the uninelligble phrases were only the least bit different than the predictable "shoot me ive been captured"
Agree with poster above about POV, but also, these lines were essentially meaningless, so those that don;t bother to look them up don't miss anything. Those that do figure it out get a slightly clearer picture of what happened.

That would mean Mikhail is not really Russian or he could make up his own backstory. Not sure about that. Do you think he's not really Mikhail? I suppose he could have taken the name of a former Dharma operative.

Another thing - both Klugh and Patchy spoke Russian with a pretty horrible accent. At first, I thought, well of course the actors are not very proficient in Russian :) but now I think what if they both were actually PRETENDING to be Russians? Do what you like with this idea. The accent was really heavy. Just thought I'd let everyone know.

Is it a coincidence that the person who wrote the manuscript and the person who marked in red upon it share not only the same name, but the same Afghan. history?

Time loop deja vu?

I'd say his really name is Andrei. The paper looks to be what the Dharma person there before was writing out of boredom, etc. Since their are red marks on it like someone proofreading it, I say that Mikhail was reading it and making notes for his new persona. I also think that maybe he gave Mikhail as a name is that it goes in with the sterotype Russian. Mikhail (Gorbechev) and Nadia (the gymnist...I can't for the life of me spell her last name) just further that.

I agree with this line of thinking. Remember that the DHARMA Initiative and by extension the Stations on the Island (the Swan, Pearl, Flame, etc) pre-dated the arrival of individuals like Inman, Desmond, and Patchy, meaning that there has been a change in who has been assigned to those stations over the years. I don't believe the Flame is any differant. Whether Patchy knew him or not, there was a person at the Flame before he arrived, and we said the residual effects of that in Enter 77.

.....Sucks that they both will be daed by end of next eppy.

I'd say his really name is Andrei. The paper looks to be what the Dharma person there before was writing out of boredom, etc. Since their are red marks on it like someone proofreading it, I say that Mikhail was reading it and making notes for his new persona. I also think that maybe he gave Mikhail as a name is that it goes in with the sterotype Russian. Mikhail (Gorbechev) and Nadia (the gymnist...I can't for the life of me spell her last name) just further that.

Comaneci. Congratulations, Romania. You've finally made it into Lost lore.

I think Mikhail is Mikhail and he is Ukranian born in Kiev, Soviet military and all that.

Sucks that they both will be daed by end of next eppy.

Yep. That's why I don't bother much with Mikhail's backstory and whether he is who he says he is.

Question - we know Sayid's father was a big war hero of some kind in Iraq. Could he tie in to this history somehow?

He could have fought in Afghanistan against the Soviets, it's a definite possibility. I got the impression Sayid was uneasy about his father's heroism in the Republican Guard so I assumed it was part of the Sunni/Shiia situation they showcased with Nadia.

Was Sayid's alias also Nadji?

I think so ... can someone else confirm?

Klugh spoke Russian? Dude, didn't see that one coming.

*waiting patiently*
jenny, The same phrase occurred to me in the shower this morning, and I hadn't read this thread. :biggrin:
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Klugh: [in English] Just do it Mikhail!
(pause)
Mikhail: I'm sorry! (shoots) (End)

Gah! Another Michael/Mikhail saying "I'm sorry" before he shoots his female colleague dead! At least Mikhail appeared to mean it.

Another thing - both Klugh and Patchy spoke Russian with a pretty horrible accent. At first, I thought, well of course the actors are not very proficient in Russian :) but now I think what if they both were actually PRETENDING to be Russians? Do what you like with this idea. The accent was really heavy. Just thought I'd let everyone know.
I think it's just the case of training the actors rather than getting totally native speaking actors in Hawaii. The Portuguese speaking men in the arctic station had strange accents according to the Brazilian Fusies, and the Arabic spoken by Sayid and the guest actors is not authentic accents either. At least they're trying to use the applicable languages instead of jibberish that you see in some productions. They know it will be analyzed! :biggrin:

I think Mikhail is Mikhail and he is Ukranian born in Kiev, Soviet military and all that.

Could be that Andrei, the typist, and Andrei, the writer, are two men from opposite sides of the same war.

Also, his name could be Mikhail Andrei or Andrei Mikhail. Just a thought.

Very interesting Russiona... and very interesting with all the different military backgrounds.

Also, his name could be Mikhail Andrei or Andrei Mikhail. Just a thought.

No, this one is off. Russians never have a middle name, two names, or anything like that. In second place there's a patronimic, which will always end in 'ich' like Mikhail Andrevich or Andrei Mikhailovich.

No, this one is off. Russians never have a middle name, two names, or anything like that. In second place there's a patronimic, which will always end in 'ich' like Mikhail Andrevich or Andrei Mikhailovich.


This is incorrect. I had friends growing up who were immigrants from Russia, and their last name had no 'ich' as any part of it. Come to think of it, one of my co-workers, I believe is 2nd generation Russian immigrant, and again, no 'ich'. So while it may be commonplace, I do not believe it is necessary.

No, this one is off. Russians never have a middle name, two names, or anything like that. In second place there's a patronimic, which will always end in 'ich' like Mikhail Andrevich or Andrei Mikhailovich.

Just out of curiosity (as you sound like you know what you're talking about), how does your explanation explain Pyotr Ilyich Tschaikowosky? Is Illyich a middle name or the "patronimic" you speak of?

i dont know russian but my bet is that Ms Klugh told him to shoot her.

Ha! Brilliant! But I think you're wrong. I think it was more, "Shoot me know, or give up your Vodka!" That'd push anyone over the edge.

Sucks that they both will be daed by end of next eppy.

Is this a spoiler?

Everybody to get from street!

EMERGENCY, EMERGENCY!!!

The actor's name is Andrew :) And his wife is Russian so he actually speaks some Russian. His was not so bad as Grace's, I think.

Another thing - both Klugh and Patchy spoke Russian with a pretty horrible accent. At first, I thought, well of course the actors are not very proficient in Russian :) but now I think what if they both were actually PRETENDING to be Russians?
Clugh was preteding anyway. she was black, she could not be Russian or Ukrainian or Latvian or "whatever Soviet" :)
As for Mikhail... He does not look like Russian, Ukrainiian etc.. But it is usual thing for American TV or movies (and I have to say that americans in Soviet or Russian movies looks terrble and fun as well) So I don't know if he was pretending to be Russian.
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Also, his name could be Mikhail Andrei or Andrei Mikhail.
Not possible. We have no tradition to give 2 or more names to children

Andrei and Mikhail are NOT last names. It's only NAMES

and their last name had no 'ich' as any part of it
I am sorry, but it's not about last name. It's shows what their father name was.
For example, If Mikhail had a father, who's name was (for example) Andrei, he would be called Mikhail Andreevich Bakunin :)

(As for the women = middlle name would be Andreevna)

Russian typical last names have "ov", "in" (like BakunIN) at the end. Ukrainian typical names have "enko", "uk", "ak" at the end. But it's not the only rule.:) (like O' in the begining of Irish last name is not the only typeof Irish last name :)

why would klugh, speaking Russian mean she was pretending to be Russian?
I know people who speak Russian and are not Russian in the least.

yeah, my girlfriend speaks Russian and what she told me was being said is the same as what was in the LostPedia entry.

Thanks for the manuscript translations!!!


Or maybe theres some kind of analogy with the Dharma/Other conflict. A small band of rebels versus an authority backed up by a very powerful nation.

That's what I was thinking!

Now, there may be all kinds of ideas as far as the authorship is concerned. My impression is the manuscript was written/typed by one person but the notes in red pen were left by another one, named Andrei. So there are at least 2 Russian-speakers involved.

Maybe, but a lot of times when people are writing, they type things up and then edit by hand.

My bet : the story/page written in Russian is the real Flame's DHARMA dude backstory, and Mikhail had to "learn" his story to become him, just as Benjamin Linus for Henry Gale.

That's a very good idea.

Question - we know Sayid's father was a big war hero of some kind in Iraq. Could he tie in to this history somehow?


I could see that. Would be interesting.

Another thing - both Klugh and Patchy spoke Russian with a pretty horrible accent. At first, I thought, well of course the actors are not very proficient in Russian :) but now I think what if they both were actually PRETENDING to be Russians? Do what you like with this idea. The accent was really heavy. Just thought I'd let everyone know.

Klugh is for sure not supposed to Russian, just supposed to be able to speak it.

Just out of curiosity (as you sound like you know what you're talking about), how does your explanation explain Pyotr Ilyich Tschaikowosky? Is Illyich a middle name or the "patronimic" you speak of?

Ilyich in Chaikovsky's name is a patronimic. A patronimic simply identifies a person's father's name. Pyotr Ilyich basically means Pyotr, son of Ilya. As Bella_Harmon has explained, a patronimic is NOT the same as last name. Last names come in all kinds of varieties. Male patronimic always end in 'ich'. And once again, Russians DON'T have middle names, and a patronimic is not something that you or your parents would choose for you. It just states your father's name.
Incidentally, using patronimics is quite a formal practice. It's entered in your passport and other documents, but most of your friends might not even know what your patronimic is. Much like English middle names I guess.

I pulled this from "Lostpedia" - Enter 77. Note that this is translation is different from the one posted earlier. See the part referring to the "territory":

"Klugh (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Klugh): Mikhail. Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Mikhail): We still have another way [out].
Klugh: We cannot risk it. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: There is another way.
Klugh: They captured us. We will not let them to get into the territory.
Klugh: You know what to do. That's an order.
Mikhail: We still have another way!
Klugh (in English): Just do it, Mikhail.
Mikhail: Forgive me. (shoots)"


My question is...How does killing Bea Klugh keep the Losties from getting into the territory? And, what is the territory?

why would klugh, speaking Russian mean she was pretending to be Russian?
I know people who speak Russian and are not Russian in the least.

I guess what I meant was that Klugh and Patchy both obviously know English very well. And Klugh is obviously not a Russian (or Ukrainian for that matter). So why communicate in Russian when they could have used English? Is it because Dharma made everyone learn Russian so Klugh had to learn it? Was it learnt specifically for situations like this where they had to get a message across to each other without clueless (Klugh-less :) monolingual losties understanding them?
Just thinking as I go along here.

Thwackum just an interesting factoid,...pirates used to speak French in order to communicate with each other while holding captives. It worked then, and it appears that using another language, works now :)

Was it learnt specifically for situations like this where they had to get a message across to each other without clueless (Klugh-less :) monolingual losties understanding them?

That would be my guess.:cool:

I pulled this from "Lostpedia" - Enter 77. Note that this is translation is different from the one posted earlier. See the part referring to the "territory":

"Klugh (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Klugh): Mikhail. Mikhail! You know what to do.
Mikhail (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Mikhail): We still have another way [out].
Klugh: We cannot risk it. You know the conditions.
Mikhail: There is another way.
Klugh: They captured us. We will not let them to get into the territory.
Klugh: You know what to do. That's an order.
Mikhail: We still have another way!
Klugh (in English): Just do it, Mikhail.
Mikhail: Forgive me. (shoots)"


My question is...How does killing Bea Klugh keep the Losties from getting into the territory? And, what is the territory?

Yep, props to whoever was able to decifer that barely intelligible piece of Russian. She does say 'We will not let them get into the territory'. I'd say the obvious guess is the 'territory' is the territory around Othersville. And Klugh knew she had to die because she knew Sayid would torture her for info on how to get to the territory and she'd spill it?

Yes, I agree. I think the territory is Otherville.
Preview speculation:
I think the territory is guarded by the electrified line that we see next week. Sayid makes Mikhail take them there, which is why they would rather die. Because torture can lead to information.

ok if that is true. they are so afraid of leaking info, isnt wanting to die a bit harsh considering Benny came right into the mouth of the Lion by going to the Losties. He showed no fear, let alone ask to be killed instead of tortured, they are too over the top in their response to Sayid. If this is all there is to it, I say the Others are well rid of these over- reactionaries.

wow, all good stuff! Thank you translators and diligent seekers!! Reading the latest bit added about the "territory" it really makes me think that whatever is so important to the others is in Othersville - they seem pretty unattached to everything else including what we are supposed to believe is the only outside communication.

Also, that they even spoke another language was interesting to me on a couple of fronts, beyond what I believe the in the moment purpose was - so the losties wouldn't understand them:

was the fact that it was Russian verses any other language relevant in some specific way beyond just "not English"
if so, how and why
Do all Others - DHARMA or not have to be bi or multi lingual


Does anyone remember if any of the Others have spoken any other languages before, I sure can't recall any?

Yup, I think I fell in love all over again!

I think it would be interesting to note, at this point, that Danielle spoke to Sayid in several different languages. Back in season one, when she captured him and was asking about Alex. Before he really came to fully and she knew what language he spoke.

And also that Danielle is the only other person who has references any place on the island using the word "territory". Danielle was not referring to the barracks. She was talking about the "dark territory", where the Black Rock is.

Another thing was that Patchy McFarmer told Sayid, in no uncertain terms that he would not hesitate to kill him AND that he would willingly die rather than disclose the information Sayid wanted. Yet, when he sees that Sayid has a map to the barracks, he doesn't appear particularly jarred by this information and he seems perfectly willing to trot along on the trek. Does that strike anyone else as odd?

I'd say the obvious guess is the 'territory' is the territory around Othersville.
Rousseau did mention the Dark Territory in S1 or S2, I can't recall.

Rousseau did mention the Dark Territory in S1 or S2, I can't recall.

The end of S1. She was taking Jack, Kate, Arzt and Locke through the Dark Territory, to the Black Rock, as the raft was leaving.

The end of S1. She was taking Jack, Kate, Arzt and Locke through the Dark Territory, to the Black Rock, as the raft was leaving.
Of course, you are right. Sorry I didn't see that you had mentioned it in your previous post! :redface:

Of course, you are right. Sorry I didn't see that you had mentioned it in your previous post! :redface:

LOL! No problem. I'm such a slow typist that sometimes entire pages have gone by, by the time I get a post posted. :eek2:

I think it would be interesting to note, at this point, that Danielle spoke to Sayid in several different languages. Back in season one, when she captured him and was asking about Alex. Before he really came to fully and she knew what language he spoke.

That's a very good point! I just watched Solitary the other day and still didn't make that connection! Good catch!

And also that Danielle is the only other person who has references any place on the island using the word "territory". Danielle was not referring to the barracks. She was talking about the "dark territory", where the Black Rock is.

Another valid point! You may be on to something... it was my theory that Danielle was the leader of the "other" Others when I was thinking about Dharma vs. Hostiles (based on what Kelvin said about him joining the Initiative and then saying "hostiles" later in the same episode).

Also, that they even spoke another language was interesting to me on a couple of fronts, beyond what I believe the in the moment purpose was - so the losties wouldn't understand them:

was the fact that it was Russian verses any other language relevant in some specific way beyond just "not English"
if so, how and why
Do all Others - DHARMA or not have to be bi or multi lingual
Does anyone remember if any of the Others have spoken any other languages before, I sure can't recall any?

Creepy Isabel can read Chinese characters as per the last time we saw the Others. Other than that, they seem to be a pretty American/North American bunch in comparison to the Flight 815'ers. Mikhail I think is the first one presenting himself as a nationality other than implied American & Canadian, I think. (Well, is Craphole Islander a nationality, for Ben? Other than his claim to have lived here all his life he seems to be current in American culture, such as being able to describe the high points of the Red Sox game.)

ok if that is true. they are so afraid of leaking info, isnt wanting to die a bit harsh considering Benny came right into the mouth of the Lion by going to the Losties. He showed no fear, let alone ask to be killed instead of tortured, they are too over the top in their response to Sayid. If this is all there is to it, I say the Others are well rid of these over- reactionaries.

Benny did have another incentive - he needed himself a spinal surgeon or he'd be dead meat anyway.

Has anybody translated what Patchy said to the cat?

Has anybody translated what Patchy said to the cat?

It's 'Leave the rug alone, Nadia'
100% clear.

found this....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikhail_Bakunin

Incidentally, using patronimics is quite a formal practice.
Yes, For example pupils in the school call their teacher, using first name with patronimics. For example: Nina Andreevna or Mikhail Ivanovich.

And as for the Belorussians, They could have last names with "Ich" at the end. and those last names are not patronimics.:)

Yes, For example pupils in the school call their teacher, using first name with patronimics. For example: Nina Andreevna or Mikhail Ivanovich.

And as for the Belorussians, They could have last names with "Ich" at the end. and those last names are not patronimics.:)

cool. educational even..
oh, its spelled patronymic


http://dictionary.reference.com/search?r=2&q=patronymic%27s

This is awesome! :biggrin:
I actually watched the Russian "Lost"-promos :wub: again today - coincidence or fate?! ;)
Anyway, thank you very much to all the helpful Fuseleers who translated the Russian portions of "Enter 77"! :clapping:
Out of curiosity (I've studied Russian for six years at school but due to a lack of practice have forgotten almost anything by now ... :shy: Say sorry big-big, my Soviet comrades! ;) ) would anybody of you be so kind as to post a Kyrillic transcript of the Mikhail / Bea-dialogue or send it to me via PM, please?
I'd just like to be able to read the lines in order to recognize the words again! :geek:
Thank you very much in advance for your support! :smile:

I think it would be interesting to note, at this point, that Danielle spoke to Sayid in several different languages. Back in season one, when she captured him and was asking about Alex. Before he really came to fully and she knew what language he spoke.
Yes, very very true. Does anyone know what languages she spoke in, besides English and French?

And also that Danielle is the only other person who has references any place on the island using the word "territory". Danielle was not referring to the barracks. She was talking about the "dark territory", where the Black Rock is.
I know I'm a little late to the game, but when I saw the additional "territory" information, I immediately thought of this as well. I do wonder if we'll ever get back to the Dark Territory and if it is something that the Others consider "dark" as well.

Yes, very very true. Does anyone know what languages she spoke in, besides English and French?

Spanish. She asks "Donde esta Alex?" The Others seem to have eclectic backgrounds so I wouldn't be surprised if some of them turn out to be proficient in languages.

I know I'm a little late to the game, but when I saw the additional "territory" information, I immediately thought of this as well. I do wonder if we'll ever get back to the Dark Territory and if it is something that the Others consider "dark" as well.

At this point, I can't take anything Danielle says at face value. I don't think the Island would be regarded with the same awe by the Others because they've lived there for so long, though this particular stretch of it might be "dark" for reasons that have nothing to do with them. Or you know... back in season one the writers just thought it sounds cool and mysterious.

I think so ... can someone else confirm?
I am almost certain it is the name he used when he had the flashback of him infiltrating a cell, the one when he came in the room and took off the 'bugged' smoke detector to prove his authenticity as a terrorist.
100%
Hallo!
Of course, I speak russian. What I have to translate? I did not see Enter 77 yet (i hope to watch it tomorrow). But if you can tell me what words, sentences I have to translate, I'll help you right now :rolleyes:

This is a little late, but I read this whole thread, and so far no link to the shot of the page w/ Russian text, so here goes: http://gallery.lost-media.com/displayimage-1261-265.html

Sorry if this has already been posted but here is some translation of the text in the typewriter.

http://www.buddytv.com/articles/lost/lost-enter-77-easter-egg-round-4801.aspx

Yes, very very true. Does anyone know what languages she spoke in, besides English and French?

I believe it's German, Spanish and Croatian.

Nice catch to the guy who found the wikipedia article! Another philosopher reference! So far that's Rousseau, John Locke, and Mikhail Bakunin! Time to start reading about all 3 of them, I bet there are clues in their philosophies! :)

Another thing was that Patchy McFarmer told Sayid, in no uncertain terms that he would not hesitate to kill him AND that he would willingly die rather than disclose the information Sayid wanted. Yet, when he sees that Sayid has a map to the barracks, he doesn't appear particularly jarred by this information and he seems perfectly willing to trot along on the trek. Does that strike anyone else as odd?

He is really trying hard to make them actually kill him off I had the impression, tried it 2 times and judging by next week, 3

He is really trying hard to make them actually kill him off I had the impression, tried it 2 times and judging by next week, 3

Well... he knows stuff. Actual valuable information. Of course he has an unnatural death wish. ;)

Yes, very very true. Does anyone know what languages she spoke in, besides English and French?
http://www.pressexecute.com/scripts/108_solitary_green.pdf

In the script it says RUSSIAN, PORTUGUESE... and ITALIAN. Kind of interesting.

http://www.pressexecute.com/scripts/108_solitary_green.pdf

In the script it says RUSSIAN, PORTUGUESE... and ITALIAN. Kind of interesting.

That's very interesting, considering we've seen at least 2 of those languages spoken on, or about, the island:

Portuguese by the people watching for the electromagnetic anomoly and the Russian is obvious

That's very interesting, considering we've seen at least 2 of those languages spoken on, or about, the island:

Portuguese by the people watching for the electromagnetic anomoly and the Russian is obvious

Italian calls to mind the incredibly hot Italian woman that Jack kissed when he was operating on her father...

Nice catch to the guy who found the wikipedia article! Another philosopher reference! So far that's Rousseau, John Locke, and Mikhail Bakunin! Time to start reading about all 3 of them, I bet there are clues in their philosophies! :)
Don't forget (Desmond) David Hume.

http://www.pressexecute.com/scripts/108_solitary_green.pdf

In the script it says RUSSIAN, PORTUGUESE... and ITALIAN. Kind of interesting.
Italian? If the writers knew all along that Russian and Portuguese would come up in the plot, maybe there are plans for Italian as well? I also thought of Gabriela, but I don't see her tied into the island...

Interesting to see Vodka at the Flame :smile: Either the guy who was there before Mikhail was (also) Russian or Mikhail ordered some to be delivered with the food drop.

I believe it's German, Spanish and Croatian.

Don't know about Croatian, but I can definitely hear German, Spanish and Italian (besides French, English and some other language(s?) I don't understand, that is).

My take on the military thing is; Kelvin was US military, Goodwin had some manner of military training, Mikhail was former Russian military, it seems quite a few of the Others/Hostiles/Dharma have military backgrounds.

Besides that, of the castaways, Desmond was Royal Scots and Sayid was Iraqi Republican Guard.

And remember AL found that old US Army knife in the jungle in The Other 48 Days

Shamu x

Don't know about Croatian, but I can definitely hear German, Spanish and Italian (besides French, English and some other language(s?) I don't understand, that is).

I know it's not in the official script, but I definitely heard it, and I'm not the only one. It probably doesn't mean anything in terms of mythology or something like that, because she probably just slipped it in as her language, she speaks it. Not that I would mind some Croatians in Lost mythology and all... :biggrin:

And also that Danielle is the only other person who has references any place on the island using the word "territory". Danielle was not referring to the barracks. She was talking about the "dark territory", where the Black Rock is.

Another thing was that Patchy McFarmer told Sayid, in no uncertain terms that he would not hesitate to kill him AND that he would willingly die rather than disclose the information Sayid wanted. Yet, when he sees that Sayid has a map to the barracks, he doesn't appear particularly jarred by this information and he seems perfectly willing to trot along on the trek. Does that strike anyone else as odd?

Very good points. I tend to believe that the "territory" Klugh speaks of is not the barricks--otherwise why not just refer to it as the "barricks." I mean, they're already speaking Russian so why not refer to something as you would refer to it. It doesn't make sense that they would say territory when they are referring to the barricks.

Obviously Mikhail and Klugh want to keep the Losties out of the territory but like you said, Mikhail didn't seem all that phased by Sayid having the map. Maybe he was kinda relived that Sayid and co. will waste their time tracking to the barricks instead of the "territory" since they don't know about the territory as it wasn't on the map (and only referred to in Russian).

My guess would be that the barricks is a Dharma place (thus put on a Dharma map) and that the "territory" is an Other's place (and therefore wouldn't be on a Dharma map).
100%
Nice catch to the guy who found the wikipedia article! Another philosopher reference! So far that's Rousseau, John Locke, and Mikhail Bakunin! Time to start reading about all 3 of them, I bet there are clues in their philosophies! :)

Don't forget Desmond David Hume! :)

It's too bad that nobody was able to help me out around here, but, fortunately, the trivia section at Lostpedia (http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Enter_77) did:
Klugh: Михаил. Михаил! Ты знаешь что делать.
Mikhail: У нас есть ещё выход.
Klugh: Мы не можем рисковать. Ты знаешь условия.
Mikhail: Есть другой выход.
Klugh: Они взяли нас. Мы не дадим им пройти на территорию.
Klugh: Ты знаешь что делать. Это приказ.
Mikhail: У нас всё ещё есть выход!
Klugh (по Английски): Just do it, Mikhail.
Mikhail: Прости меня. (стреляет)
:clapping:

Clugh was preteding anyway. she was black, she could not be Russian or Ukrainian or Latvian or "whatever Soviet" :)
As for Mikhail... He does not look like Russian, Ukrainiian etc.. But it is usual thing for American TV or movies (and I have to say that americans in Soviet or Russian movies looks terrble and fun as well) So I don't know if he was pretending to be Russian.
100%

Not possible. We have no tradition to give 2 or more names to children

Andrei and Mikhail are NOT last names. It's only NAMES


I am sorry, but it's not about last name. It's shows what their father name was.
For example, If Mikhail had a father, who's name was (for example) Andrei, he would be called Mikhail Andreevich Bakunin :)

(As for the women = middlle name would be Andreevna)

Russian typical last names have "ov", "in" (like BakunIN) at the end. Ukrainian typical names have "enko", "uk", "ak" at the end. But it's not the only rule.:) (like O' in the begining of Irish last name is not the only typeof Irish last name :)


I am German and know black people born & raised there so they are Germans& they speak German :)

Is there no black people in Russia?

Or am I misunderstanding what you are saying?

ps: Im curious Sayid past & what he did wouldn't someone like that speak different languages?

Was Sayid's alias also Nadji?

In the transcript posted on losthatch.com, they spell Sayid's Paris alias "Najeev".