Well TPTB said we would get a game changer, and if this isn't it, I don't know what is.

Does anyone think the presence of Cooper has anything to do with the visions of Christian's father? I used to be dead set again the idea that Christian was alive, but now it actually seems possible.

Agreed, I think that this may be the same thing as with Christian... unless Christian is the same as Dave... or they all are creations of the box.

I think it really depends on the circumstances surrounding Cooper's presence on the island. If he was somehow teleported, or duplicated, or it's really not Cooper, etc. then I agree 100%.

But, it could be that the Others just used their apparently limitless resources to capture Cooper and bring him to the Island.

Yeah, I really don't think this is the big "game changer". If it is, I'm kind of disappointed.

What if Cooper was sitting in the Tail Section and he was one of the people that the Hostiles/Others captured on the first night?

I'd ordinarily say that blowing up the sub was the game changer. But I believe Ben for once. With the communications down due to the EMT event, once that sub was gone, no one could find the Island again. So blown up or not, the sub itself ain't no game changer.

A challenge to Ben's power (which Ben seems MAJORLY worried about) could change the game. What happens to our losties now could change the game. If full-fledged war breaks out among losties and Others, that could change the game.

In short, I don't think the ACTUAL game-changer has happened yet. But things are now set up FOR the actual game-changer to happen. Next couple of eppys, I'd say.

I have no idea of this is the "game-changer." Was it supposed to happen in this episode? It might be the game changer. Or it just might be tooooooooooootally messed up and awesome and twisty. heh. ;)

The crash happens. They research the entire group of survivors, see that Locke can walk again and target him for assimilation. Immediatly they use their resources to find Locke's dad and send the sub out to get him in preparation for this moment. Its roughly 2 months between the crash and the "anomaly" right? They had time to do it.

It seems strange that Ben is so interested in the fact that John can walk when he was crippled before. Had Ben known about this all along, wouldn't he have asked about it while being held in the Hatch in S2? The only explanation for why he wouldn't have asked then would be that he had just found out about it since then, somehow.

If they can reach out and have a bus kill Juliet's ex-husband, then they can do anything in the outside world as long as they can communicate with it, which I don't think they can do now.

There's also the possibility that Cooper is a higher up in the Others' organization, even Jacob himself. I'm not putting it past Ben for this all to be part of a con so he doesn't lose his authority after becoming ill.

But I'm even more confused about just who the Others are and what they want. I mean, if you want to live in suburbia on a beautiful island, just move to Hawaii. ;)

Cardie

It seems strange that Ben is so interested in the fact that John can walk when he was crippled before. Had Ben known about this all along, wouldn't he have asked about it while being held in the Hatch in S2? The only explanation for why he wouldn't have asked then would be that he had just found out about it since then, somehow.
Ben mentioned this in tonight's episode. He said it would of revealed his true identity or something along those lines, I can't remember. Bottom line is, if Ben mentioned to Locke his paralysis it would have of raised suspicions.

I'm having trouble believing this is a "game changer" because I'm not sure what if anything has changed. Cooper's on the Island... and Ill delight in seeing Locke do whatever with him. But other than that the fundamental lay of the land is basically the same, yes?

I'm not familiar with where the "game changer" quote comes from, I try not to read spoilers... but if it's the same thing as the "People are gonna say Lost 'Jumped the shark'" quote then Damon was talking about "Flashes Before Your Eyes." At San Diego Comic-Con 2006, Damon said something would happen midseason that would cause people's brains to fry or make them say the show had jumped the shark. In the Entertainment Weekly issue that came out before "Flashes", Damon says the Desmond episode will utilize a flashback device that will cause people to say the show "jumped the shark."

So I'm thinking it's "Flashes" and not this eppy? :confused:

If they can reach out and have a bus kill Juliet's ex-husband,

Cardie

Perhaps Juliet has the same ability Walt has...and no one from the Island is responsable for those incidents?

I read on EW that next week's episode is the "game changer" episode. I'm confused.

I read on EW that next week's episode is the "game changer" episode. I'm confused.

Can someone please point to the "game changer" quote (as long as it's not within too spoliery a context -- EEK!)?

And on the most recent podcast, Damon and Carlton were pretty clear that next week's was going to be quite something.

Good thoughts Crimson Rabbit, but I really feel like the sub being blown up was truly the 'gamechanger'.

Now the Others are completely 'in the same boat' as the Losties... stranded and lost!

It seems strange that Ben is so interested in the fact that John can walk when he was crippled before. Had Ben known about this all along, wouldn't he have asked about it while being held in the Hatch in S2? The only explanation for why he wouldn't have asked then would be that he had just found out about it since then, somehow.


Actually Ben said he wanted to ask JOhn in the hatch but couldn't or he would give away who he really was.

It was all said this episode by Ben.

If they can reach out and have a bus kill Juliet's ex-husband, then they can do anything in the outside world as long as they can communicate with it, which I don't think they can do now.

There's also the possibility that Cooper is a higher up in the Others' organization, even Jacob himself. I'm not putting it past Ben for this all to be part of a con so he doesn't lose his authority after becoming ill.

But I'm even more confused about just who the Others are and what they want. I mean, if you want to live in suburbia on a beautiful island, just move to Hawaii. ;)

Cardie

I suppose the impression could be made that whatever motivation Juliet had to suggest that the only she could join Mittelos was with her ex-husband getting hit by the bus and the presence of Cooper on the Island when he was clearly on Locke's mind came from the same source.

But Ben also said that once the sub left, it wouldn't be able to find its way back to the Island. So everyone would be stranded there, anyway.

This ain't the game-changer, folks. THAT is still to come! :eek:

The game changer is that there is a Box(smoke monster) that can do what Ben said it could do. They also confirmed the Islands healing properties are real. That Locke blew up the only means on communcation to the world And that the only way off the Island has been destroyed

I hardly think that is unimportant. Sometimes I wonder if people actually watch the show :) haha

I hope it's not the game changer as it's a bit underwhelming for that title.

Much of the game changer evidence and speculation comes from having read many spoilers, so trying to argue about it here is like having one hand tied behind your back.

If anyone wants to debate on the basis of all the evidence, come on over to Spoilers.

Cardie

Cue the theme from Jaws. Now more than ever I'm convinced this is VR program to help those who have mental health issues. Anthony Cooper locked up in storage..........yea right. And with fresh bruises and cuts from trying to escape off an island in the middle of no where ....and no clue of how to get away.

And once more we are told" I was born here" by Ben. Well that seems to point towards Adam and Eve as potential parents because I haven't seen any old people. If Ben was born there he must have been the "hostile" at one time.

Well, here's why I think it may be the game changer.

We basically know now why the Others are on the island, and why they choose to stay there. Presumably, they each were recruited in a manner similar to Juliet, and they each have a reason to want the "box." Ben (and/or his higher-ups) is trying to setermine how to manipulate the island's powers to give them exactly what they want. This is why he is trying to understand why Locke was healed and he was not.

To me, knowing why the Others are there is a huge game changer. We know now that they are not related to Dharma at all-- only that they basically ground Dharma to dust after they arrived and looted everything they could from them, from facilities to food.

The game changing part is that Locke will now join the others and learn the mysteries of the Island, IMHO. I think that there is no way Ben will let Jack stay with the others, and he will get sent back to camp with Kate and Sayeed. There are definitely star wars parallells here, ie. Locke will be Vader to Ben's Emperor, Jack will lead the rebel alliance, along with Han (Sawyer), who ends up with Leah(Kate). I guess that makes Hurley "Chewie". Or Vincent.

Sometimes the phrase game changer isn't the big 3 run blast in the 8th that puts you ahead by one. Its the walk the pitcher gives to a number 9 batter who had struck out three times prior to that. I guess what I'm trying to say is: perhaps we were hoping for a huge, Earth-shattering eppy but instead we got the base on balls.

Could the island not work b/c Ben is evil?
How long has Coop been on the island?
How are we to define Hostile? I'm begining to think that Ben may have been born on the island and he "took over." We've got some Heaven's Gate overtones here....

i've been lurking for a bit... this topic really grabbed my attention though... i still think the sub is the game-changer. even though it was blown up, it opens the possibility for that "change in leadership" that's been suggested for awhile... ben himself mentioned he'd lose credibility without that sub. now that it isn't there... that "surprising" change in leadership can occur...

From what I have read, I thought the game changing episode was coming in the week after next:


The dreaded Pikki episode - which I am personally psyched for!


However, the game has changed now that John's personal demon/daddy, is actually on the island (I, for one, think he may have been there the whole time), Jack is the one running away rather than Kate, Ben and his minions seems to know the most intimate details of the Losties past lives somehow, and the sub is blown to smithereens! Your move.

Well people said the game changer was the sub, but naaah i don't think so, i think it's still to come, and that person might have just posted it but i'm not gonna read spoilers. Spiling LOST for me is a fate worse than death, it's one of those shows that can shock and scare you and if i already know what's gonna happen then well...that feeling is gone and i won't enjoy the show.

Blowing up the sub is clearly the "game changer."

Now Jack and Juliette are forced to remain on the island. Both have sour opinions of the others and will moreso now that they can't leave. Ben will try to keep them but now Jack will be Hellbent on leading the Losties (Army) against Locke and Ben's others.

Now that Jack can't leave this means war!

I think the game changing moment was when Locke blew up the sub and not allowing Jack to leave. It looked, to me, that by the look Jack gave Locke at the end...that they were now on different sides. Jack has to break out of there, get Kate and Sayid and go back to the camp. Locke will stay behind because Ben will be using him because 'the island favors him

I still think the game changing is the fact that Anthony Cooper seems to be on the island giving credence to the song and dance Ben was trying to peddle to Locke. Locke already "knew" the place was special by the conversation he had with Rose who also knew. Bens' box bs will seem fact with the appearance of Mr Cooper. I don't believe it.

1. I think the box is a metaphor.

2. I think the game changer is next week. I'm expecting something radical.

1. I think the box is a metaphor.

2. I think the game changer is next week. I'm expecting something radical.

1. I think you're right, unless Hurley owns the company. :biggrin:

2. I soooo hope you're right.

I believe the game changer is the Anything Box, which to me seems to prove that the Others have confined/have some control over part of Smokey.

It's also the payoff on the Yemi reveal--"You speak to me as if I were your brother."

But Desmond's time traveling was a game changer too. There may be something important yet to come with the Pikki episode.

Everything hinges now on the circumstances of Cooper's arrival on the isalnd. Was he in Mexico (or Talahasse) and Alpert or someone else abducted him and brought him to the island? Was he drinking margaritas and suddenly appeared in Otherville? He seemed prety beat up, so it looks like he resisted. It's a wait watch and see how his sotry develops.

If I had to pick one thing from this episode to be the "Game changer" (which, along with 'jump the shark' is rapidly become my least favorite buzzword on these forums), it would be the fact that Anthony Cooper is on the island. We had lots of possibilities, though:

Anthony Cooper being on the island
Locke is very, very important
Ben could be losing his leadership
The sub is no more, no more possibility for escape
Jack was gonna bail
The "magic box"

Overall, this episode had a TON of things happen, but I don't think any of them were grand enough to be called a game changer.

For the record, I'm really excited that Ben validated Locke's belief that he is in tune with the island. For a while I wasn't sure, because Locke's motivations are suspect at times, but to know that he was right, and that the island IS telling him what to do, and the island DID heal him (and theoretically tried to take back the use of his legs in Deus Ex Machina), is amazing in my opinion, and is one of the most valuable parts of this episode.
100%
Everything hinges now on the circumstances of Cooper's arrival on the isalnd. Was he in Mexico (or Talahasse) and Alpert or someone else abducted him and brought him to the island? Was he drinking margaritas and suddenly appeared in Otherville? He seemed prety beat up, so it looks like he resisted. It's a wait watch and see how his sotry develops.

I said the same thing, Annie... I wasn't sure if I liked that fact that Cooper was on the island, but I decided to wait and see the explanation before I freak out. :)

If Cooper is part of The Others, that throws their "we're the good guys" statement right into the garbage. Cooper is not a good guy no matter how you slice it.

The last instance we have of anyone being brought to the island was Juliet, and that was 3 years ago. Has Cooper been there that long?

Is it possible Cooper even scammed The Others to make it to the island, and that's why he's being held against his will now?

This explanation is gonna be amazing, I need to know how he got there!

According to TPTB and EW, the "game-changer' is supposed to be heavily related to:


The unveiling of Paulo and Nikki's past in next week's episode, where they came from originally, and why we are only seeing them now after 3 seasons.