JACK: That's why the Sox will never win the series.
SAWYER: What's that?
JACK: Huh?
SAWYER: What'd you just say?
JACK: I said that's why the Red Sox will never win the series.
SAWYER: What the hell is that supposed to mean?
JACK: Just something my father used to say -- went through life knowing that people hated him. Instead of taking responsibility for it, he just put it on fate. Said he was made that way.
SAWYER: Your daddy, he a doctor, too?
JACK: He was. He's dead. Why do you want to know about my father?
SAWYER: No reason.
Since "The Man From Tallahassee," it seems that the concept of faith may have jumped from a sub-plot involving Locke to possibly the most important key to the mysteries of the island.

Christian Shepherd is, without a doubt, the most prominent flashback-only character on the show, his influence spanning to Sawyer's, Claire's, Ana-Lucia's, and of course Jack's flashbacks. Christian's attitude toward life, exemplified by the famous series quote discussed above, is the attitude of a man who has accepted defeat before he's even begun at something-- the exact opposite of the kind of faith which it seems "helps things happen" on the island.

I think Christian's attitude represents the dichotomy between the way the oustide world is depicted in the series and the way the Island is depicted-- a place where faith is rewarded.

CHRISTIAN SHEPARD: I have what it takes. Don't choose, Jack, don't decide. You don't want to be a hero, you don't try and save everyone because when you fail. . . you just don't have what it takes.Christian is a man who concedes that things are just set a certain way and cannot be changed by a person's determination. If the "box" concept from TMFT is true, and if it is based on a person's individual faith, Christian wouldn't last two seconds on the Island.

It seems to be that Christian represents the listless faithlessness of so much of the outside world, the opposite of a character like Locke. And that has become more important than ever before with recent evidence.

Since "The Man From Tallahassee," it seems that the concept of faith may have jumped from a sub-plot involving Locke to possibly the most important key to the mysteries of the island.

Christian Shepherd is, without a doubt, the most prominent flashback-only character on the show, his influence spanning to Sawyer's, Claire's, Ana-Lucia's, and of course Jack's flashbacks. Christian's attitude toward life, exemplified by the famous series quote discussed above, is the attitude of a man who has accepted defeat before he's even begun at something-- the exact opposite of the kind of faith which it seems "helps things happen" on the island.

I think Christian's attitude represents the dichotomy between the way the oustide world is depicted in the series and the way the Island is depicted-- a place where faith is rewarded.

Christian is a man who concedes that things are just set a certain way and cannot be changed by a person's determination. If the "box" concept from TMFT is true, and if it is based on a person's individual faith, Christian wouldn't last two seconds on the Island.

It seems to be that Christian represents the listless faithlessness of so much of the outside world, the opposite of a character like Locke. And that has become more important than ever before with recent evidence.

I think you are right. I haven't quite viewed Christian in this light, but I haven't really given him much thought beyond thinking he was analogous to Cancer Man in the XFiles. Now that you mention this, though, it kind of seems like Jack and Locke are two sides of the same coin, with their fathers being successful (in their lines of work) up to a point and using that success to antagonize the sons, more or less. Jack and Locke were continually crushed by their faith in the real world (Jack couldn't fix his marriage, he couldn't save his Dad, Locke's Dad wouldn't love him regardless of the protection - and kidney - he was given, etc...). But now, on the island, it looks like John is getting rewarded for his faith, but is Jack? I think the sub blowing up (if it in fact did get blown up) was a major setback, faithwise. Is it that Jack is still putting faith in a father figure (Ben), whereas Locke is not? These are kind of rhetorical questions, but I'm getting on the same page with you (I think).

Regarding the box, I wonder if it works both ways - does it only bring things to the island, or can it also get things off the island. Looks like we'll never know as long as the castaways' wishes are made real. All of their "need to get away from the real world" aspirations are stronger than their "need to be rescued" wishes.

Good insights.

I think it makes sense if you consider that Jack is sort of the main character on Lost...he's the person whose eyes we first saw through. And if we see the world through his eyes as a person who always tries...even if he fails...He doesn't like to be defeated. He isn't okay with accepting it. Even when it's inevitable, he tries until the very end.

So his father presents the opposite view to that...and that's the struggle that Jack's encountered his whole life. That may be a central struggle to the show as well. I don't know if it's that it works Jack's father's way in the real world...and the opposire on the island. I think it's more complicated than that.

But I think that the relationship between those two extremes...and all the gray in between is a major theme for the show.