He is very much alive, before the show aired they posted the LOST missing bits of Christian as the plane crashed on ABC's website behind the trailer for the episode.. significant?? Also Jack, Claire and John have all seen him, no-ones apparition is viewable by many, at least to nothing we've seen so far.

So consider this, Christian Shepard is alive on the island.

We know Ben has seemingly time travelled, so what's to say Shepard doesn't do the same, the one we see in Jacks flashbacks is in fact the cabin Shepard travelling back to aid Jack to go to Australia. He staged his death to lead Jack to Oz, hence no body in the coffin, (and why the first 'ghost' we ever see is Shepard, curious to see if his son made it to the island??)
.
ALSO we now know Abbadon did the very same to Locke, urging him to go to Australia.
It appears key characters are being persuaded to end up on that flight, or Australia.
Thinking back, Sawyer was set up to go to Australia too.

PS - If Jacob wasn't in the cabin where was he?? Or was he just 'invisible again'? Perhaps even Jacob can alter his appearance and is in fact every single 'ghost' people see, comlete with whispers. Maybe why John couldn't see him the first time was because Jacob was directing his visibility to Ben.. who knows!

Coimmetns please..
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A little confusing but basically Shepard 'dies' after what we saw in Cabin fever, later on when we travels back.

Also there might be a paradox, if he truely was dead in the coffin, when it entered the island where Shepard is alive the paradox would have been active and his body gone.

Perhaps he died because he had no constant.

That is better than any theory I can come up with!!

My thoughts about Christian on the mobisode, dogs are believed to be able to see ghosts, or spirits.

We assume Ben can teleport. I don't think the time of his trip was proven to be out of sinc with our timeline, so time travel has not yet bet proven nor disproven.

I have read some theories that Jacobs spirit is in Christian.... But for me, manifestations on the island are Smokie, Smokey = Jacob

He's dead as a doornail, you're bonkers.
We don't know Ben has traveled back in time, where the heck did you get that from?

We assume Ben can teleport. I don't think the time of his trip was proven to be out of sinc with our timeline, so time travel has not yet bet proven nor disproven.

I meant to save time jumped, not back in time was thinkin of Des. I think time travel it's pretty much proven with the re-appearing rabbits in the Orchid video, the fact Desmond has gone back and influenced reality, and that Ben is unsure of the year, indicating he is aware of time defects.

Hey every theorist is bonkers - look at Einstein and Darwin they laughed at them! ;)

He's dead as a doornail, you're bonkers.
We don't know Ben has traveled back in time, where the heck did you get that from?

No need for personal insults. ;)

I don't know what's going on with Christian, but I find it very intriguing.

I think he is dead and that the dude you see in the cabin is no other than a dead body being puppeted by JACOB... which is probably not a person.

Anyone else think it might be possible that Christian got bit by a Medusa spider? There had to be a point to that Nikki and Paulo episode, maybe this is it?

Christian was definitely dead well before the plane crash. Jack examined the body, and he's a doctor. Christian's death shouldn't be up for debate.

And TPTB have repeatedly said that the dead stay dead. But maybe we shouldn't think of this in such black and white terms - dead versus alive. Maybe due to The Island magic, there's something in between for souls that end up on The Island.

Clearly Christian is not just a projection of Jacob/The Island/Smokey. He appears to people that don't know him and with whom he'd have no reason to impersonate Jack's father (the dog, Hurley, Locke, etc.). He's shown a great interest in both his children, and his grandchild. He introduced himself to Locke as Christian, and clearly stated he was not Jacob, but could speak on his behalf.

I don't think it's any coincidence that Christian's body was not in his coffin and has not been found on The Island. Nor can it be a coincidence that his name is derived from that of Christ, the figure of RESURRECTION.

Jacob/The Island/Smokey is disembodied for some reason. He needs vessels to communicate and act on his behalf. He speaks to children and adults who are special (Ben, Walt, Locke), giving them amazing powers in furtherance of his will. He also uses the bodies and/or souls of those who died on The Island, or end up on The Island (Christian, Charlie, Libby, Horace Godspeed, etc.).

In summary, Christian is dead, but he's "there" in corporeal form on The Island, just as Charlie is dead, but was "there" in Los Angeles to visit Hurley.

Can someone please remind me of any proof that Christian is dead. Did we ever see his corpse? His coffin was empty and he has appeared on the island on several occasions now. Also it seems obvious to me he has been on the island before.

Another theory - Locke couldn't walk before he crashed on the island. Could have the island have brought back Christian from the dead?

If it really is possible to travel in time and space from the Island then it's entirely possible that the Christian on the Island is in fact a real, live Christian from some point in his own timeline prior to his death in Australia.

It also explains how Charlie can show up and talk to Hurley in the future when he already died on the Island - it's a past Charlie sent forward in time to do the bidding of whatever force is on the Island.

(However, it doesn't explain why Charlie apparently had absolutely no recollection of any of this when we saw him alive. Maybe he is somehow possessed or has his memories wiped when he returns to his present)

Please remember that if there is in fact time travel going on (which is almost certain...unstuck in time, the Billy Pilgrim/Vonnegut reference) Then the debate here is an exercise in futility. Christian can be dead AND can show up in the future and in the past.

So while dead = DEAD it appears to the viewer that dead \= DEAD.

And your dead debate is actual dead.

There is no proof of his death. Did Jack do a viewing or anything. I think he came to Australia and had them put the body on the plane. He was in a big hury to just get it all over with. I lik the time travel concept. Forward or backwards -- whatever. Let's face it people, they are jumping through time.

I think he is dead as doornail. What we are seeing is a physical manifestation of Christian by Smokey/the Island/Jacob or whatever.

I find it strange Christian wanted Aaron off the Island, maybe this has some seriously devilish repurcussions

Anyone else think it might be possible that Christian got bit by a Medusa spider? There had to be a point to that Nikki and Paulo episode, maybe this is it?

Since the Medusa spider episode aired, I have been leaning toward this. Considering the spider bite's effects, it would be easy to fake a death, thus allowing Christian to manipulate Jack onto the plane leading to the crash. Jack is now exactly where Christian wants him to be .... on the island.

richtallent (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/member.php?u=66536), good luck with this thread. I posted a poll asking this very question last week. It came out 4 for alive, over 40 for dead. :redface: I dare you to make a poll out of this.

I agree with you, Christian is alive; so you "must" be all wrong, lol!

Quick background: The coroner in Sidney that showed Jack the dead body was positively ID'd as being on the beach after the plane crash in S1. As pointed out above, the spider venom, (and many other pharm. drugs) can cause the appearance of death. It was a planned faked death all along. We see his coffin in the caves it was carried to; it is empty. Other poeple freed him from the coffin; it was smashed open. We see him walking around. We never see him actually 'disappear' any more than the (confirmed by TPTB) living wife of Goodwin did recently. His new appearance shows that he looks better and fitter than ever, like he quit drinking, and has gotten a nice Island tan.

Furthermore, I say that Claire is also alive, but IS possessed/drugged out in some manner.

richtallent (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/member.php?u=66536), good luck with this thread. I posted a poll asking this very question last week. It came out 4 for alive, over 40 for dead. :redface: I dare you to make a poll out of this.

I agree with you, Christian is alive; so you "must" be all wrong, lol!

Quick background: The coroner in Sidney that showed Jack the dead body was positively ID'd as being on the beach after the plane crash in S1. As pointed out above, the spider venom, (and many other pharm. drugs) can cause the appearance of death. It was a planned faked death all along. We see his coffin in the caves it was carried to; it is empty. Other poeple freed him from the coffin; it was smashed open. We see him walking around. We never see him actually 'disappear' any more than the (confirmed by TPTB) living wife of Goodwin did recently. His new appearance shows that he looks better and fitter than ever, like he quit drinking, and has gotten a nice Island tan.

Furthermore, I say that Claire is also alive, but IS possessed/drugged out in some manner.

Um when did we 'positively ID' the coroner's body on the beach? You got pics of that or a link to a post with pics? Since we're talking scientific here I figured proof would be nice.

Also, that coffin was basically hurled there by the plane, not carried by the losties.. The body could have fallen out (note how easily it was for jack to open it up) in the air and dropped somewhere else, out of sight. I dunno honestly it just doesn't seem like a safe way to travel to the island, hiding in a coffin... Especially since the actual seat-belted oxygen-masked flotation-seat covered passenger survival rate was what, around 17-20% I believe (over 324 passengers on it total, do not forget that). I mean if i was going to guarantee my arrival safely i dont think i'd hide in a coffin... well maybe he had pillows stuffed all around it haha


Anyone have pictures of his body? If a coroner examined him, there would be autopsy stitches/scars. After all, he could have only made his diagnosis with a full examination (which would kill any 'faker' by the way). Any pics of that? Also how cold is it in their freezer storage lockers...

Honestly it seems like such a wild stretch (I can almost accept the "abbadon is walt" theory over this one... almost) that he woul go through all that just to guarantee arrival on the island. It's almost more conceivable that he is now Jacob's puppet, of sorts...

Anyone have pictures of his body?

There doesn't appear to be autopsy stitches:

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Image:JackMorge.jpg

Also, according to lostpedia, the morgue doctor was indeed "gas man" in the pilot episode.

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Geoff_Heise

Christian is dead. But dead people, if their bodies are on the island, and if they are "special" enough, they can manifest physically before people. Christian and Charlie are very special that way. Ana Lucia, Boone, and Horace can't do that, but they are special enough that they can manifest in dreams.

Um when did we 'positively ID' the coroner's body on the beach? You got pics of that or a link to a post with pics? Since we're talking scientific here I figured proof would be nice.

Also, that coffin was basically hurled there by the plane, not carried by the losties.. The body could have fallen out (note how easily it was for jack to open it up) in the air and dropped somewhere else, out of sight. I dunno honestly it just doesn't seem like a safe way to travel to the island, hiding in a coffin... i dont think i'd hide in a coffin... well maybe he had pillows stuffed all around it haha

Anyone have pictures of his body? If a coroner examined him, there would be autopsy stitches/scars. After all, he could have only made his diagnosis with a full examination (which would kill any 'faker' by the way). Any pics of that? Also how cold is it in their freezer storage lockers...

Honestly it seems like such a wild stretch (I can almost accept the "abbadon is walt" theory over this one... almost) that he woul go through all that just to guarantee arrival on the island. It's almost more conceivable that he is now Jacob's puppet, of sorts...

"Honestly", I have never read such a mean spirited post, tearing down simple background info that is years old, and making many "wild" (as you said) assumptions. Thanks so much!
read more carefully. I said he was ID'd, not dead. He was seen running around on the beach alive. some say he was they guy who was sucked into the jet engine, but i'm not claiming that, it's not important to this, that he was on the plane is.

This is all old news that anyone who has been around since S1 would know. I was just doing a quick recap of known old info.

Oh, that's right, the coffin was 'hurled' thru the jungle, thru the heavy thicket that protected the entrance to the cave, then sailed into the cave, where it landed on a nice perch where it just happened to open up...! Can you possibly see how ridiculous this sounds? didn't i say it was carried by and opened by other people? as in Others. That's why it opened easily for Jack, cuz it had been opened already.

No one ever said he had an autopsy either. He was shown laying on a morgue slab. I believe the coroner said to the effect that 'he died of alcohol abuse'. so why would a autopsy be ness'y if the cause of death was already diagnosed and not contested?
Here are the pics: I'm sure you will find a way to not believe them anyway.
http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Image:Gas_man.jpg

http://images.lostpedia.com/images/f/f5/MorgueDoctor.jpg

richtallent (http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/member.php?u=66536), see, i told you good luck with this thread.

Can someone please remind me of any proof that Christian is dead. Did we ever see his corpse? His coffin was empty and he has appeared on the island on several occasions now. Also it seems obvious to me he has been on the island before.

Another theory - Locke couldn't walk before he crashed on the island. Could have the island have brought back Christian from the dead?

I honestly can't remember the episode name off the top of my head, but Jack came to Australia for the exact purpose of identifying his father's body. Christian was dead, Jack saw his corpse, and if I could just agree more with what the above poster stated: whatever "affliction" people have before they arrive on the island (paralysis, cancer, even DEATH) they lose it once they are embraced by the island's healing "magic".

Just a guess though, I'm probably DEAD wrong.

Christian is dead but being dead on the Island means something radically different than off the Island. I don't think time travel has to come into it.

Christian is dead but being dead on the Island means something radically different than off the Island. I don't think time travel has to come into it.

But some of the dead people on the Island are dead by normal terms and other do not seem to be. why is that? and as was posted, TPTB said 'once they're dead, they stay dead"
One thing i noticed on a re-watching. Christian, who was always shown before on Lostia in his suit and tie, is now in a snappy sports shirt. And before he was scruffy, and baggy-eyed from all his drinking. Now he is now tanned, shaved, fit and younger looking. "Death Becomes Him"?
He actually looked more alive than "Claire 2.0" sitting in the rocker looking all puffy and evil-eyed. go figure!?
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I honestly can't remember the episode name off the top of my head, but Jack came to Australia for the exact purpose of identifying his father's body. Christian was dead, Jack saw his corpse, and if I could just agree more with what the above poster stated: whatever "affliction" people have before they arrive on the island (paralysis, cancer, even DEATH) they lose it once they are embraced by the island's healing "magic".

Just a guess though, I'm probably DEAD wrong.
nope, i do agree with everything you say. :)
Just add in that IF the coroner was in on a 'ruse'; Christian would not had to have been dead when he called Jack; he (coroner) could administer the venom that makes him appear dead before Jack comes over from the hotel. he can sign off on the death cert. and set things up with the funeral parlor others for chris' coffin. Remember also, there was a mix-up at the airport re, the coffin, which upset Jack a great deal, and was another clue. Coroner would have gone with the coffin (as the pics have been shown here) to make sure all goes as planned.

Lets try our best to tone down the snide remarks and back-and-forth baiting shall we??

Just because we disagree with someone...it doesn't make them wrong...debate the info not the merit of the poster.

But some of the dead people on the Island are dead by normal terms and other do not seem to be. why is that? and as was posted, TPTB said 'once they're dead, they stay dead"
One thing i noticed on a re-watching. Christian, who was always shown before on Lostia in his suit and tie, is now in a snappy sports shirt. And before he was scruffy, and baggy-eyed from all his drinking. Now he is now tanned, shaved, fit and younger looking. "Death Becomes Him"?
He actually looked more alive than "Claire 2.0" sitting in the rocker looking all puffy and evil-eyed. go figure!?
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A poster on another board(T8rtotz) came up with a Dead Island theory at the beginning of the Season and I think he is correct.
People that die on the Island can "appear" off the Island;whereas,people that die off the Island can manifest or "appear" on the Island. As to why some die "normal deaths" on the Island? I think that's because that is what the Island wants...remember you only die if the Island wants you dead.

Christian who I think is dead is the only exception so far to the Dead Island theory above ...which could be bec/ he is a major player in all of this so he can appear anywhere.

Anyone else think it might be possible that Christian got bit by a Medusa spider? There had to be a point to that Nikki and Paulo episode, maybe this is it?I copied this response from the other thread:

My theory: Christian was never dead. His death was faked, using the spiders that paralyze you, in order to get him to the island. Not sure why, but that could be the reason for the whole Nikki and Paolo thing, to show that the spiders could do that.I'm totally on board with this theory and have actually been saying so since the Niki & Paulo episode. :biggrin:

That Christian is dead was reinforced YET AGAIN in the most recent podcast by Damon and Carlton. Or do you "Christian Shephard conspiracy theorists" just refuse to acknowledge those anymore?I don't believe a word they say.

Yeah, I am not positive on this but I don't *think* that they have straight out lied when answering important questions.What about just before Shannon died when they said "it would be silly to kill off a girl."?

They have said TIME and TIME again, in podcasts, print interviews, live interviews, that Christian Shephard is dead.And this could be explained as truth by saying, "Yes, Christian was dead at that point - as far as the viewers knew at that time." They aren't about to just give up one of the shows biggest mysteries in a podcast. :rolleyes:

Also, here is a bit of the Transcript from "White Rabbit" to clear some things up:
[FLASHBACK]

[Shot of Jack and a medical examiner walking down a hall in some kind of medical building (morgue).]

MEDICAL EXAMINER: The police found him in an alley in Queens Cross. Now, a tox screen showed a blood alcohol content, which for a man of his size, probably brought on myocardial infarction - a sizable, and fatal heat-attack.

[They go into a room with a body bag on a gurney. The Medical Examiner unzips it. His father is there.]

JACK [crying]: That's him.

[Shot of Jack in the jungle, crying. We hear the sound of ice in a glass, and a branch breaking or moving. Jack grabs a log out of the fire to use as a torch and follows. He comes upon the caves and water. He sees a doll in the water which he picks up. There are a bunch of dolls scattered on the ground from a box. There is other debris there from a section of a plane. He finds a coffin.]

[FLASHBACK]

[We see Jack at a counter at the Sydney airport.]

JACK: What do you mean you won't put it on the plane?

AGENT: I'm sorry Mr. Shephard, but our policy is that the body must have the proper documentation. There's just no latitude.

JACK: No latitude? No latitude?

AGENT: Without the proper documents. . .

JACK: Look, you can't do this to me. I'm ready to go now.

AGENT: Perhaps another carrier. . .

JACK: No!

[Shot of Jin in line looking over at Jack's outburst.]

JACK: I want you to listen to me, okay. Because I'm asking you a favor, Chrissy. I'm standing in front of you in the same suit that I'm wearing to my father's funeral and I'm asking you a favor. In 16 hours I need to land at LAX, and I need that coffin to clear customs because there's going to be a hearse waiting there. And I need that hearse to take me and that coffin to a cemetery. Why? Why, Chrissy, can't I just bring him to a funeral home and make all the arrangements? Why can't I really take my time with it? Because I need it to be done. I need it to be over. I just -- I need to bury my father.

[Shot of Jack at caves looking at the coffin. He opens it and there's no body inside. He gets angry and beats it with a metal pipe.]

There doesn't appear to be autopsy stitches:

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Image:JackMorge.jpg

Also, according to lostpedia, the morgue doctor was indeed "gas man" in the pilot episode.

http://www.lostpedia.com/wiki/Geoff_Heise

Awesome thanks, but now i wonder... same PERSON, or just same EXTRA?

interesting about the autopsy too... makes it all the more eerie since Jack is a doctor and well he should have noticed that kind of thing... I mean arent they required to do the autopsy in order to DETERMINE the cause of death officially? Any coroners out there?

Awesome thanks, but now i wonder... same PERSON, or just same EXTRA?

interesting about the autopsy too... makes it all the more eerie since Jack is a doctor and well he should have noticed that kind of thing... I mean arent they required to do the autopsy in order to DETERMINE the cause of death officially? Any coroners out there?

As posted right above you:

MEDICAL EXAMINER: The police found him in an alley in Queens Cross. Now, a tox screen showed a blood alcohol content, which for a man of his size, probably brought on myocardial infarction - a sizable, and fatal heat-attack.

The ME said "probably". I would take that to mean that no autopsy took place and he was giving an educated guess. I'm sure the rules are all different in Austrailia, but here at least, I'm pretty sure they only do autopsies by request unless there is evidence of foul play.

And the thing that would concern me more than an autpsy, would be the fact that a body should be embalmed for preservation, you'd think especially to make an intercontinental flight. But meh, if the ME is lying about Christian being dead, I'm sure he'd lie about him being embalmed. Or maybe not being embalmed was why Jack was having problems getting the casket on the plane (documention).

I think whoever said that about Nikki/Paulo and the spider ... that could be. What was the point of that episode? It seems like there does need to be a point to it...

I do not think Christian is dead. Why do so many people die and stay dead (Boone, Shannon, Ana Lucia,) just to believe he is not dead. Why would he call himself Christian if he is just Jacob really? So many parts to this don't make sense.


I do not think Claire is dead either, though.

But some of the dead people on the Island are dead by normal terms and other do not seem to be. why is that?
Because different people have different strength of spirit. Christian was at an extremely low point of his life when he died, but still had enormous inner character and strength. And what Charlie lacked in that regard, he gained through the trials he underwent on the island (like the moth). The two of them have the ability to really leverage the powers of the island. Others, such as Boone, Ana Lucia, and Goodspeed, have the ability to manifest in dreams and visions, and possibly in voices, but not physically.

And before he was scruffy, and baggy-eyed from all his drinking. Now he is now tanned, shaved, fit and younger looking. "Death Becomes Him"?

Yes, exactly. When people are alive, they grow older, not younger. Also notice, he didn't become the person we saw in the cabin overnight. At first he was still wandering around the island with a drink in his hand. In one of his early attempts to appear to jack, he ends up standing in the middle of the surf. This "manifestation" ability apparently takes some practice. And his personal journey is obviously ongoing.

I always looked at the Nikko/Paulo/Spider ep as just a fun non-threaded episode. A non-connected, well written episode.

I don't have time to read through all the posts so if this was already said then sorry.

I think Christian faked his death knowing Jack will put him on 815 so that he can also get back to the island. I believe he did this by using the spiders that paralyzed Nikki and Paulo.

I wonder if Christian was first to rule the others then Richard, then Ben, then Locke...

Is it possible that Jacob is just the name of the island? Maybe it is alive? Naw... I don't really know how or what the hell Jacob is gunna be or who it is going to be. This show is too much, but in such a good way lol.

I think Christian faked his death knowing Jack will put him on 815 so that he can also get back to the island.

You know, this doesn't even have to be the case (faking his own death). I think it's a common consensus that everyone on 815 was brought there by one means or another, on purpose right? The survivors anyway. What if Jack and Christian were meant to be there? Kill two birds with one stone? Make Christian dead with Jack to accompany the body on the same flight. The Medusa Spider is obviously native to the island, Alpert's been shown here and there across the globe and across time manipulating this event. Christian may have been in the dark just as much as everyone else who was brought to the island.

This is something that I started to think about after the discovering Danielle and Karl's bodies scene in SNBH. Something was weird about how they were "buried":

Danielle: http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg162/getlostpodcast/4x10/4x10-00009.jpg

Karl: http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg162/getlostpodcast/4x10/4x10-00011.jpg

If Keamy and Co. killed them, I can't think of any reason at that point that they would bother to bury them at all, but if they did, you think that they would at least cover their faces?

So my theory is that the island is absorbing their bodies. Possibly, the Island chooses who to take and who not to take---Yes to Horace Goodspeed, No to Nikki and Paulo, Yes to Charlie, No to Dr. Overboard?

If the Island absorbs people on its own terms, that could potentially explain why Christian's body was missing----fell out of coffin, absorbed by island.

It might also explain why the Others seemingly left Goodwin's body out to rot, and maybe why they have the weird raft burial ceremony. (For these purposes, I am understanding the Island to extend out into the sea as far as it is difficult to leave or enter by conventional mean--i.e. not by a special bearing).

It may also explain why Ben left his father sitting in the van---he's not touching the ground, so he cannot be absorbed---and maybe even why Adam and Eve were found dead as they were---in the cave and not on the ground---maybe they didn't want to be part of the island, or maybe someone didn't want them to be.

This is something that I started to think about after the discovering Danielle and Karl's bodies scene in SNBH. Something was weird about how they were "buried":

Danielle: http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg162/getlostpodcast/4x10/4x10-00009.jpg

Karl: http://i248.photobucket.com/albums/gg162/getlostpodcast/4x10/4x10-00011.jpg

If Keamy and Co. killed them, I can't think of any reason at that point that they would bother to bury them at all, but if they did, you think that they would at least cover their faces?

So my theory is that the island is absorbing their bodies. Possibly, the Island chooses who to take and who not to take---Yes to Horace Goodspeed, No to Nikki and Paulo, Yes to Charlie, No to Dr. Overboard?

If the Island absorbs people on its own terms, that could potentially explain why Christian's body was missing----fell out of coffin, absorbed by island.

It might also explain why the Others seemingly left Goodwin's body out to rot, and maybe why they have the weird raft burial ceremony. (For these purposes, I am understanding the Island to extend out into the sea as far as it is difficult to leave or enter by conventional mean--i.e. not by a special bearing).

It may also explain why Ben left his father sitting in the van---he's not touching the ground, so he cannot be absorbed---and maybe even why Adam and Eve were found dead as they were---in the cave and not on the ground---maybe they didn't want to be part of the island, or maybe someone didn't want them to be.

Yes!!!! I agree!!! It looked exactly like the Island was "absorbing" them...They were in process of becoming one with the Island.

I posted the following in another thread...
http://www.thefuselage.com/Threaded/showthread.php?t=94962&page=15


In Jungian theory, the Cosmic Man is an archetypical figure that appears in creation myths of a wide variety of mythology. Generally he is described as helpful or positive, and is also frequently the physical basis of the world, such that after death parts of his body became physical parts of the universe. He also represents the oneness of human existence, or the universe.

The Island could "collect" beings/souls....to help with its survival.

I don't like stepping on people's theories, Hugh, but Horace's body was still in the pit, not absorbed.


However, I too have kicked around the "sentient being" theory myself. When I was a kid (long before Lost), I imagined "what if" Earth were a sentient body, and the human race nothing more than a disease or parasite, killing it. The Earth defends itself with it's "immune system" in the form of natural phenomena, the plague, AIDS, etc. But we are resilient, like cancer, slowly spreading and killing our host.

In this hypothesis, the island would be the brain?

But some of the dead people on the Island are dead by normal terms and other do not seem to be. why is that? and as was posted, TPTB said 'once they're dead, they stay dead"
[quote=Pythagoras99;1887593]Because different people have different strength of spirit. Christian was at an extremely low point of his life when he died, but still had enormous inner character and strength. And what Charlie lacked in that regard, he gained through the trials he underwent on the island (like the moth). The two of them have the ability to really leverage the powers of the island. Others, such as Boone, Ana Lucia, and Goodspeed, have the ability to manifest in dreams and visions, and possibly in voices, but not physically.


That sounds pretty good to me. Another thing worth pointing out is that the person always had some sort of a connection to the person they appeared to, so perhaps that also had something to do with it, maybe said connection was also able to help to keep them there.
One thing i noticed on a re-watching.Christian, who was always shown before on Lostia in his suit and tie, is now in a snappy sports shirt. And before he was scruffy, and baggy-eyed from all his drinking. Now he is now tanned, shaved, fit and younger looking. "Death Becomes Him"?
He actually looked more alive than "Claire 2.0" sitting in the rocker looking all puffy and evil-eyed. go figure!?
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nope, i do agree with everything you say. :)
Just add in that IF the coroner was in on a 'ruse'; Christian would not had to have been dead when he called Jack; he (coroner) could administer the venom that makes him appear dead before Jack comes over from the hotel. he can sign off on the death cert. and set things up with the funeral parlor others for chris' coffin. Remember also, there was a mix-up at the airport re, the coffin, which upset Jack a great deal, and was another clue. Coroner would have gone with the coffin (as the pics have been shown here) to make sure all goes as planned.

Perhaps the person can choose how they want to appear. So when he was appearing to Jack he was coming back the way that Jack last saw him, and then when he was appearing to Claire he decided to look friendly and more fatherly, so he cleaned himself up and made his clothes a little more casual looking.

I think Christian faked his death knowing Jack will put him on 815 so that he can also get back to the island. I believe he did this by using the spiders that paralyzed Nikki and Paulo.

Makes perfect sense. Ana Lucia drags Christian back from harassing Claire's aunt in a drunken stupor, and then, knowing that flight 815 is the only way onto the island, he sits at the bar and weighs his two options... A) He could buy a ticket. B) Since he has this Medusa spider, he could go out in the alley and let it bite him. That someone will maybe find him, and maybe the coroner will be incompetent enough to not figure out that he's only paralyzed, and accidentally forget to embalm him, and for some reason have body bags with breathing holes. And that way, if his wife is able to convince jack to come bring him home, and if Jack is able to find the right morgue, Jack will throw him in a casket and try to fly him home. And that way maybe he would happen to get flight 815. And then maybe the airline will load the casket it a pressurized part of the baggage hold, so he doesn't die after take off. Then BINGO the plane crashes and he's on the island. All without the hassle of having to buy a ticket.

Plan A is just too simple. It would never work. I think Plan B is the only reasonable alternative.
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Perhaps the person can choose how they want to appear. So when he was appearing to Jack he was coming back the way that Jack last saw him, and then when he was appearing to Claire he decided to look friendly and more fatherly, so he cleaned himself up and made his clothes a little more casual looking.

I just had an interesting thought about that. Maybe Christian NEEDS Claire there in order to be appearing there for Locke! Maybe that's why she's there. Her presence is not only necessary for him to be communicating in that way, but it is determining his apparel. My first thought when I saw him was that he looked all outbacky, with the work boots and all. Whereas, in Jack's presence, it's the more austere image and formal image.

Maybe that's why she's ok with what's happening. Jacob has shown her the future, and she knows that Aaron has to get off the island, and that with Jack leaving, it's essential that she stays to facilitate Christian's work to save the island, and thus the world. It's like a chain of communication from Jacob to Christian through Claire to Locke.

Wow, that is it. I've never been more sure of anything in my life! (to quote locke just before he almost destroyed the world.) :biggrin:

Makes perfect sense. Ana Lucia drags Christian back from harassing Claire's aunt in a drunken stupor, and then, knowing that flight 815 is the only way onto the island, he sits at the bar and weighs his two options... A) He could buy a ticket. B) Since he has this Medusa spider, he could go out in the alley and let it bite him. That someone will maybe find him, and maybe the coroner will be incompetent enough to not figure out that he's only paralyzed, and accidentally forget to embalm him, and for some reason have body bags with breathing holes. And that way, if his wife is able to convince jack to come bring him home, and if Jack is able to find the right morgue, Jack will throw him in a casket and try to fly him home. And that way maybe he would happen to get flight 815. And then maybe the airline will load the casket it a pressurized part of the baggage hold, so he doesn't die after take off. Then BINGO the plane crashes and he's on the island. All without the hassle of having to buy a ticket.

Plan A is just too simple. It would never work. I think Plan B is the only reasonable alternative.

LOL! But Plan B is a LOT less unrealistic when it is not just Christian in on the plan ...

Since he has this Medusa spider, he could go out in the alley and let it bite him. That someone will maybe find him, and maybe the coroner will be incompetent enough to not figure out that he's only paralyzed, and accidentally forget to embalm him, and for some reason have body bags with breathing holes. And that way, if his wife is able to convince jack to come bring him home, and if Jack is able to find the right morgue, Jack will throw him in a casket and try to fly him home. And that way maybe he would happen to get flight 815. And then maybe the airline will load the casket it a pressurized part of the baggage hold, so he doesn't die after take off. Then BINGO the plane crashes and he's on the island. All without the hassle of having to buy a ticket.#1 I've heard that America is one of the only countries in the world that regularly embalms their dead. (I'm not sure how truthful this is though.) #2 If this theory is correct I believe completely that the Dharma/Others people are totally involved and paying off the mortuary, etc... (Remember how quickly Juliet's husband was killed?) #3 I don't think Christian was on the plane. I think he time travelled to the island from Australia. I think his drinking / alcoholicness was all a sham leading up to him faking his own death.

I don't like stepping on people's theories, Hugh, but Horace's body was still in the pit, not absorbed.


No problem, my ideas are more play-doh than precious ;)

I knew that Horace doesn't exactly fit the theory, but I threw it out there anyway. But he _was_ a vision in a dream and not a physical manifestation. Oh well.

Oh and nice reference addictedfan, I like the idea of the Cosmic Man, very poetic...

No problem, my ideas are more play-doh than precious ;)

I knew that Horace doesn't exactly fit the theory, but I threw it out there anyway. But he _was_ a vision in a dream and not a physical manifestation. Oh well.

Oh and nice reference addictedfan, I like the idea of the Cosmic Man, very poetic...
Thank ya,Hugh!

Horace may still fit the "Island Absorption" theory (which I ascribe to also)if the Horace in Locke's dream was not sent by the Island but by a negative force/spirit that exists within or on the Island.

#1 I've heard that America is one of the only countries in the world that regularly embalms their dead. (I'm not sure how truthful this is though.) #2 If this theory is correct I believe completely that the Dharma/Others people are totally involved and paying off the mortuary, etc... (Remember how quickly Juliet's husband was killed?) #3 I don't think Christian was on the plane. I think he time travelled to the island from Australia. I think his drinking / alcoholicness was all a sham leading up to him faking his own death.
No offense at all but you think his drinking/alcoholism was a sham? That would be a looooong time to "pretend". He was a long time drinker and alcoholic....at least back several years and probably during Jack's childhood. Plus, all signs point to Jack also becoming an alcoholic/addict and the disease of alcoholism/addiction is linked to genetics.

Look there's noway he faked his death, there's nothing in that. Because:

1 - He would have to fake his death at exactly the right day in advanced to allow his son to fly over, ID him, arrange for it to be sent home and book it on ONE exact flight on ONE certain day maybe upto a week in advance.

2 - He would have to know the plane was going to the island!! If he did it to get to the island just buy a ticket! Obvious huh.

Like the writers say. What is dead is dead. I stick by my original idea at top of this post

Well, time will tell. :shrug:

Well, what if Alpert or Abaddon got him in the alley with Medusa Spider venom, knowing that Christian's death would bring Jack to Australia? And what if the morgue guy gave Christian a "booster shot" of the venom at the morgue, and only put Christian in the fridge for a little while to present him to Jack for identification?